Russel Quong's "Perl in 20 pages"

Discussion in 'Perl Misc' started by Mister.Fred.Ma@gmail.com, Sep 21, 2006.

  1. Guest

    , Sep 21, 2006
    #1
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  2. <> wrote:
    > Does anyone know where the latest version can be found? A cached
    > version of Document version 2001a is available at
    > http://tinyurl.com/h6c7d



    It says:

    To Perl, lists and arrays are identical

    while the Perl FAQ says:

    What is the difference between a list and an array?


    I would tend to believe the FAQ.


    --
    Tad McClellan SGML consulting
    Perl programming
    Fort Worth, Texas
     
    Tad McClellan, Sep 21, 2006
    #2
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  3. Paul Lalli Guest

    wrote:
    > Does anyone know where the latest version can be found? A cached
    > version of Document version 2001a is available at
    > http://tinyurl.com/h6c7d
    > (http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache...st.vwh.net/perlin20/&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1).
    > It's the latest I can find, but the server hosting the original is not
    > available. I haven't seen recent references to the document on Google
    > or Groups. Thanks.


    Why would you want to use this? A cursory examination of the document
    shows:
    inconsistent usage of strict and warnings
    inconsistent indentation
    using terms "list" and "array" interchangably (Claiming that the
    documentation does as well - when clearly the author has not grasped
    the distinction between the terms)
    Using bareword filehandles
    Not checking return values of open()
    Recommendations for C-Style for loops, with no mention of `for my $i
    (0..$#array) { } `
    Stating that undef has the "value" of the empty string
    Using prototypes on subroutines
    Using the English module without the '-no_match_vars' protector

    ..... at that point I stopped reading. Please don't use this document
    to learn Perl. Please?

    Paul Lalli
     
    Paul Lalli, Sep 21, 2006
    #3
  4. Uri Guttman Guest

    >>>>> "MFM" == Mister Fred Ma <> writes:

    MFM> Does anyone know where the latest version can be found? A cached
    MFM> version of Document version 2001a is available at
    MFM> http://tinyurl.com/h6c7d
    MFM> (http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache...st.vwh.net/perlin20/&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1).
    MFM> It's the latest I can find, but the server hosting the original is not
    MFM> available. I haven't seen recent references to the document on Google
    MFM> or Groups. Thanks.

    i love reading bad perl web tutes. this is as bad as they get. this
    paragraph alone highlights the total confusion of the author. could he
    have used any more hash synonyms?

    A hash variable stores a array of (key, value) pairs,
    collectively known as a map. Typically, the key and value are
    different but related values, such as a person's name and phone
    number. A hash is implemented in Perl so that you can quickly
    look up the value given the key, when there are many (key,
    value) pairs. From a algorithms/data structures standpoint, a
    Perl hash implements a dictionary, mostly likely using a hash
    table.

    wow.

    we do need to make a bad perl web tute site with links and reviews. in
    my copious free time i will do this. :)

    uri

    --
    Uri Guttman ------ -------- http://www.stemsystems.com
    --Perl Consulting, Stem Development, Systems Architecture, Design and Coding-
    Search or Offer Perl Jobs ---------------------------- http://jobs.perl.org
     
    Uri Guttman, Sep 21, 2006
    #4
  5. David Squire Guest

    David Squire, Sep 21, 2006
    #5
  6. Paul Lalli Guest

    Mirco Wahab wrote:
    > Thus spoke (on 2006-09-21 13:06):
    >
    > > Does anyone know where the latest version can be found? A cached
    > > version of Document version 2001a is available at
    > > http://tinyurl.com/h6c7d
    > > (http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache...st.vwh.net/perlin20/&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1).
    > > It's the latest I can find, but the server hosting the original is not
    > > available.

    >
    > Ths has been updated lately and is now available
    > in a *much* *much* better Version, *2.0* I'd guess.
    >
    > It now includes a comparison w/Python too - as a bonus ...
    > http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.12.20.165434.32.html


    That's *better*? Well, it's updated certainly, but it's still rife
    with errors, misleading statements, and bias. I sincerely hope no
    one's trying to learn either Perl or Python from drivel like this...

    Paul Lalli
     
    Paul Lalli, Sep 21, 2006
    #6
  7. Le Thu, 21 Sep 2006 20:50:07 +0200, Mirco Wahab a écrit :

    >
    > Ths has been updated lately and is now available in a *much* *much* better
    > Version, *2.0* I'd guess.


    Actually, I'm afraid this article in some way tries tries (and
    fails) to be funny. Too bad.

    --
    Pluralitas non est ponenda sine necessitate.
    Guillaume d'Ockham.
     
    Emmanuel Florac, Sep 21, 2006
    #7
  8. Keith Keller Guest

    On 2006-09-21, Uri Guttman <> wrote:
    >
    > i love reading bad perl web tutes. this is as bad as they get. this
    > paragraph alone highlights the total confusion of the author. could he
    > have used any more hash synonyms?
    >
    > A hash variable stores a array of (key, value) pairs,
    > collectively known as a map. Typically, the key and value are
    > different but related values, such as a person's name and phone
    > number. A hash is implemented in Perl so that you can quickly
    > look up the value given the key, when there are many (key,
    > value) pairs. From a algorithms/data structures standpoint, a
    > Perl hash implements a dictionary, mostly likely using a hash
    > table.


    He forgot ''associative array''. ;-)

    --keith

    --
    -francisco.ca.us
    (try just my userid to email me)
    AOLSFAQ=http://www.therockgarden.ca/aolsfaq.txt
    see X- headers for PGP signature information
     
    Keith Keller, Sep 21, 2006
    #8
  9. John Bokma Guest

    Uri Guttman <> wrote:

    > i love reading bad perl web tutes. this is as bad as they get. this
    > paragraph alone highlights the total confusion of the author. could he
    > have used any more hash synonyms?


    yes!

    >
    > A hash variable stores a array of (key, value) pairs,
    > collectively known as a map. Typically, the key and value are
    > different but related values, such as a person's name and phone
    > number. A hash is implemented in Perl so that you can quickly
    > look up the value given the key, when there are many (key,
    > value) pairs. From a algorithms/data structures standpoint, a
    > Perl hash implements a dictionary, mostly likely using a hash
    > table.


    associative array, look up table, index :-D

    A hash variable stores a array of (key, value) pairs,
    collectively known as a map. Typically, the key and value are
    different but related values, such as a person's name and phone
    number. An associative array is implemented in Perl so that you can
    quickly look up the value given the key, when there are many (key,
    value) pairs in this look up table. From a algorithms/data
    structures standpoint, a Perl index implements a dictionary, mostly
    likely using a hash table.

    >:->


    > we do need to make a bad perl web tute site with links and reviews. in
    > my copious free time i will do this. :)


    I will review
    <http://visibooks.com/pdfs/TheVisibooksGuidetoPERLBasics50.pdf>

    ^^^^ Yes, the title says
    it all.

    next week when I am hopefully recovered of the first glance at this book
    excerpt.

    --
    John Experienced Perl programmer: http://castleamber.com/

    Perl help, tutorials, and examples: http://johnbokma.com/perl/
     
    John Bokma, Sep 22, 2006
    #9
  10. David Squire <> wrote:
    > Mirco Wahab wrote:
    >
    >> It now includes a comparison w/Python too - as a bonus ...
    >> http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.12.20.165434.32.html

    >
    > Hey! That's off-topic here. It's about some language called 'Pearl' :)



    Such a language does exist, which is why Larry left the "a" out
    of the name of his language:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PEARL_programming_language

    It sure doesn't seem something that could be compared to Python though...


    --
    Tad McClellan SGML consulting
    Perl programming
    Fort Worth, Texas
     
    Tad McClellan, Sep 22, 2006
    #10
  11. John Bokma Guest

    Tad McClellan <> wrote:

    > David Squire <> wrote:
    >> Mirco Wahab wrote:
    >>
    >>> It now includes a comparison w/Python too - as a bonus ...
    >>> http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.12.20.165434.32.html

    >>
    >> Hey! That's off-topic here. It's about some language called 'Pearl'
    >> :)

    >
    >
    > Such a language does exist, which is why Larry left the "a" out
    > of the name of his language:
    >
    > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PEARL_programming_language
    >
    > It sure doesn't seem something that could be compared to Python
    > though...


    WHEN fire ACTIVATE extinguish; :)

    --
    John Experienced Perl programmer: http://castleamber.com/

    Perl help, tutorials, and examples: http://johnbokma.com/perl/
     
    John Bokma, Sep 22, 2006
    #11
  12. Uri Guttman Guest

    >>>>> "MD" == Michele Dondi <> writes:

    MD> On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 14:20:34 -0400, Uri Guttman <>
    MD> wrote:

    >> i love reading bad perl web tutes. this is as bad as they get. this


    MD> You're either lying or removing past horrors. Do you remember the
    MD> earthquake guy's one? And the one by a lady whose name eludes me for
    MD> the moment, but which was reported here exactly for that reason: i.e.
    MD> being an awfully bad -but supported by some institution's grant!- perl
    MD> tutorial?


    i recall all of those. but this guy's comments on arrays and lists being
    the same since the docs say so is as bad as any of those others. the
    absolute certainty of his comments are hysterical. but the only way to
    truly judge these tutes is to make up a page of links, reviews and
    quotes. a worthy project. maybe i will make it a wiki so we can all join
    in.

    uri

    --
    Uri Guttman ------ -------- http://www.stemsystems.com
    --Perl Consulting, Stem Development, Systems Architecture, Design and Coding-
    Search or Offer Perl Jobs ---------------------------- http://jobs.perl.org
     
    Uri Guttman, Sep 22, 2006
    #12
  13. Mirco Wahab <-halle.de> writes:

    > Regarding the purpose of the whole Visibooks stuff,
    > (http://visibooks.com/study.html) the book *might* be
    > not that bad after all.
    >
    > To give, from the start, young people clear
    > instructions to get technical things done
    > (which they don't really understand and didn't
    > expect to master at all) helps them to get a
    > sense of self-efficacy and motivates them for
    > some time.


    Even then, it would be far better to give accurate information.

    One of the things I hated when I was teaching was that I'd run into
    students who had been taught something that was flat-out wrong,
    usually because it was expedient for the teacher. A student without
    exposure to such a teacher only had to learn the materials and
    techniques; a student who had had such a teacher, though, had to spend
    extra effort un-learning what he or she had previously learned.

    If the point of Visibooks is to create programmers full of wrong
    information but who nonetheless have high confidence in their
    correctness -- well, they can stop now. Such programmers are in more
    than adequate supply.

    Charlton
     
    Charlton Wilbur, Sep 24, 2006
    #13
  14. >>>>> "Charlton" == Charlton Wilbur <> writes:

    Charlton> One of the things I hated when I was teaching was that I'd run into
    Charlton> students who had been taught something that was flat-out wrong,
    Charlton> usually because it was expedient for the teacher. A student without
    Charlton> exposure to such a teacher only had to learn the materials and
    Charlton> techniques; a student who had had such a teacher, though, had to
    Charlton> spend extra effort un-learning what he or she had previously
    Charlton> learned.

    That's why we admit up front that we're "rounding off the corners" sometimes
    in Learning Perl and Intermediate Perl... at least in the main text. We
    always fix the lies in the footnotes. Hence, lots of footnotes.

    However, in class, we don't have time to say the footnotes, so again, we admit
    we lie, and that they should "read the book" to get the lies. I wish there
    were another way. I guess it's sad perhaps when people don't even keep track
    of when they are lying.

    print "Just another Perl hacker,"; # the original!

    --
    Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
    <> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
    Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
    See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training!

    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
     
    Randal L. Schwartz, Sep 24, 2006
    #14
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