Third Party Modules

Discussion in 'Python' started by Brock, Apr 28, 2009.

  1. Brock

    Brock Guest

    Hi Everyone,

    I know this is most likely a basic question and you will roll your
    eyes, but I am just starting out with Python (hobbyist) and I see many
    tutorials on the web referring to the use of external modules.

    However, when I locate them, they often come as a zipped folder with a
    number of files. How do I install them? In addition, is there an
    easy way to manage external modules? Some I see require additional
    modules not included.

    Where I am coming from is R, which has a point-and-click way of
    getting packages not distributed with the version of the software, so
    that is my point of reference.

    Many thanks!

    - Brock
     
    Brock, Apr 28, 2009
    #1
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  2. Brock

    tuxagb Guest

    On 28 Apr, 17:02, Brock <> wrote:
    > Hi Everyone,
    >
    > I know this is most likely a basic question and you will roll your
    > eyes, but I am just starting out with Python (hobbyist) and I see many
    > tutorials on the web referring to the use of external modules.
    >
    > However, when I locate them, they often come as a zipped folder with a
    > number of files.  How do I install them?  In addition, is there an
    > easy way to manage external modules? Some I see require additional
    > modules not included.
    >
    > Where I am coming from is R, which has a point-and-click way of
    > getting packages not distributed with the version of the software, so
    > that is my point of reference.
    >
    > Many thanks!
    >
    > - Brock


    If you are on Unix-like machine, unzip the archive in a some
    directory, do cd into the new directory
    and, from command line, do: python ./setup.py build (verify there is
    the script setup.py), and then
    python ./setup.py install (with root's permissions). On Win32 usually
    there are an automatic installer.

    Hi.
     
    tuxagb, Apr 28, 2009
    #2
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  3. Brock

    John Nagle Guest

    Brock wrote:
    > Hi Everyone,
    >
    > I know this is most likely a basic question and you will roll your
    > eyes, but I am just starting out with Python (hobbyist) and I see many
    > tutorials on the web referring to the use of external modules.
    >
    > However, when I locate them, they often come as a zipped folder with a
    > number of files. How do I install them? In addition, is there an
    > easy way to manage external modules? Some I see require additional
    > modules not included.


    There are several different mechanism for handling this, and they all suck.
    The whole Python module distribution scheme is so uncoordinated that there's
    no uniform way to do this. It's not your fault.

    There's "python ./setup.py". There are "eggs", which are supposed to
    install very simply, but in practice usually fail to install properly,
    producing obscure error messages. There are Windows installers.
    There's no consistency.

    I'm currently struggling with guiding users through installation
    of a Python program I put on SourceForge. I have to explain to them how
    to install three different external modules which don't have compatible
    installation mechanisms.

    I'm not going to put Python software out for public use again. I don't
    have the time to deal with this crap.

    John Nagle
    Animats
     
    John Nagle, Apr 28, 2009
    #3
  4. On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 1:15 PM, John Nagle <> wrote:
    > Brock wrote:
    >>
    >> Hi Everyone,
    >>
    >> I know this is most likely a basic question and you will roll your
    >> eyes, but I am just starting out with Python (hobbyist) and I see many
    >> tutorials on the web referring to the use of external modules.
    >>
    >> However, when I locate them, they often come as a zipped folder with a
    >> number of files.  How do I install them?  In addition, is there an
    >> easy way to manage external modules? Some I see require additional
    >> modules not included.

    >
    >   There are several different mechanism for handling this, and they all
    > suck.
    > The whole Python module distribution scheme is so uncoordinated that there's
    > no uniform way to do this.  It's not your fault.
    >
    >   There's "python ./setup.py".  There are "eggs", which are supposed to
    > install very simply, but in practice usually fail to install properly,
    > producing obscure error messages.  There are Windows installers.
    > There's no consistency.
    >
    >   I'm currently struggling with guiding users through installation
    > of a Python program I put on SourceForge. I have to explain to them how
    > to install three different external modules which don't have compatible
    > installation mechanisms.
    >
    >   I'm not going to put Python software out for public use again.  I don't
    > have the time to deal with this crap.
    >
    >                                        John Nagle
    >                                        Animats
    > --
    > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
    >


    Well, John, I do have the time to deal with this crap, since I'm
    retired, or unemployed, or somewhere in between. I have no idea if you
    have any useful software to share. But feel free to give your users my
    email address () and I'll do my best to help.
     
    David Robinow, Apr 28, 2009
    #4
  5. On Apr 28, 12:15 pm, John Nagle <> wrote:
    > Brock wrote:
    > > Hi Everyone,

    >
    > > I know this is most likely a basic question and you will roll your
    > > eyes, but I am just starting out with Python (hobbyist) and I see many
    > > tutorials on the web referring to the use of external modules.

    >
    > > However, when I locate them, they often come as a zipped folder with a
    > > number of files.  How do I install them?  In addition, is there an
    > > easy way to manage external modules? Some I see require additional
    > > modules not included.

    >
    >     There are several different mechanism for handling this, and they all suck.
    > The whole Python module distribution scheme is so uncoordinated that there's
    > no uniform way to do this.  It's not your fault.
    >
    >     There's "python ./setup.py".  There are "eggs", which are supposed to
    > install very simply, but in practice usually fail to install properly,
    > producing obscure error messages.  There are Windows installers.
    > There's no consistency.
    >
    >     I'm currently struggling with guiding users through installation
    > of a Python program I put on SourceForge. I have to explain to them how
    > to install three different external modules which don't have compatible
    > installation mechanisms.
    >
    >     I'm not going to put Python software out for public use again.  I don't
    > have the time to deal with this crap.
    >
    >                                         John Nagle
    >                                         Animats


    I've found the eggs thing to work more often than not. But I've seen
    it fail before too. I'm not sure where tuxagb got the idea that
    there's usually a Windows installer. If I want something, it's usually
    more like a 50-50 chance of there being an installer.

    Anyway, hopefully the snakebite project will help with this a little.

    Mike
     
    Mike Driscoll, Apr 28, 2009
    #5
  6. En Tue, 28 Apr 2009 15:59:54 -0300, Mike Driscoll <>
    escribió:
    > On Apr 28, 12:15 pm, John Nagle <> wrote:
    >> Brock wrote:
    >>
    >> > I see many
    >> > tutorials on the web referring to the use of external modules.
    >> > However, when I locate them, they often come as a zipped folder with a
    >> > number of files.  How do I install them?  In addition, is there an
    >> > easy way to manage external modules? Some I see require additional
    >> > modules not included.

    >>
    >>     There's "python ./setup.py".  There are "eggs", which are supposed
    >> to
    >> install very simply, but in practice usually fail to install properly,
    >> producing obscure error messages.  There are Windows installers.
    >> There's no consistency.

    >
    > I've found the eggs thing to work more often than not. But I've seen
    > it fail before too. I'm not sure where tuxagb got the idea that
    > there's usually a Windows installer. If I want something, it's usually
    > more like a 50-50 chance of there being an installer.


    If the package includes some C extensions, typical Windows users won't be
    able to compile them, so a binary distribution is a must.
    Usually, it's enough to execute:
    python setup.py bdist_wininst
    and let distutils do its work.

    --
    Gabriel Genellina
     
    Gabriel Genellina, Apr 29, 2009
    #6
  7. Brock

    Jorgen Grahn Guest

    On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 10:15:23 -0700, John Nagle <> wrote:
    > Brock wrote:
    >> Hi Everyone,
    >>
    >> I know this is most likely a basic question and you will roll your
    >> eyes, but I am just starting out with Python (hobbyist) and I see many
    >> tutorials on the web referring to the use of external modules.

    ....

    > There are several different mechanism for handling this, and they all suck.
    > The whole Python module distribution scheme is so uncoordinated that there's
    > no uniform way to do this. It's not your fault.

    ....
    > I'm not going to put Python software out for public use again. I don't
    > have the time to deal with this crap.


    And which other language would have made it easier? Once you have odd
    third-party dependencies, you (or your users, rather) will have
    problems.

    /orgen

    --
    // Jorgen Grahn <grahn@ Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu
    \X/ snipabacken.se> R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!
     
    Jorgen Grahn, Apr 29, 2009
    #7
  8. Brock

    David Lyon Guest


    > On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 10:15:23 -0700, John Nagle <> wrote:
    >> Brock wrote:
    >>> Hi Everyone,
    >>>
    >>> I know this is most likely a basic question and you will roll your
    >>> eyes, but I am just starting out with Python (hobbyist) and I see many
    >>> tutorials on the web referring to the use of external modules.

    > ...
    >
    >> There are several different mechanism for handling this, and they

    > all suck.
    >> The whole Python module distribution scheme is so uncoordinated that

    > there's
    >> no uniform way to do this. It's not your fault.

    > ...
    >> I'm not going to put Python software out for public use again. I

    > don't
    >> have the time to deal with this crap.


    People are working on this.... for example, I am working on a Package
    Manager Project on sourceforge to solve exactly these problems.

    Hopefully soon we will be ready to do a release.

    In the spirit of open source, you would be welcome to join our project,
    and do some testing. Report some bugs etc.

    http://sourceforge.net/projects/pythonpkgmgr/

    Best Regards

    David
     
    David Lyon, Apr 29, 2009
    #8
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