vertically split text?

[Mark Parnell]

Can you make html look so it looks like the facing pages of an open
book? that is, the text on the bottom of the left hand (page, column)
side continues at the top of the right hand, 'facing page'?

Only by splitting the text into 2 sections yourself, and putting each in
a separate <div> (for example). CSS3 allows columns like that but it is
only a draft, and it will be several years before it is widely supported
enough to consider using on a public site.

 

[Day Brown]

Can you make html look so it looks like the facing pages of an open
book? that is, the text on the bottom of the left hand (page, column)
side continues at the top of the right hand, 'facing page'?

 

[mbstevens]

Only by splitting the text into 2 sections yourself, and putting each in
a separate <div> (for example). CSS3 allows columns like that but it is
only a draft, and it will be several years before it is widely supported
enough to consider using on a public site.

The question reminded me of this...
http://www.alistapart.com/d/imagemap/example2.html
It does some interesting things with image maps, but it leaves out any
actual text content on the pages -- probably for the reasons you have given
us. I don't know any way to do it, either.

 

[Richard]

Can you make html look so it looks like the facing pages of an open
book? that is, the text on the bottom of the left hand (page, column)
side continues at the top of the right hand, 'facing page'?

Use a pair of table columns.
I've seen a lot of news sites do this.
Some use tables, others use divisions.
Go fancy with css and give the center a "crease" look.

 

[Carolyn Marenger]

Can you make html look so it looks like the facing pages of an open
book? that is, the text on the bottom of the left hand (page, column)
side continues at the top of the right hand, 'facing page'?

There are a number of ways you can do it, but be warned, if your 'pages'
are taller than the viewing window, we may have to scroll down the first
column, then scroll back up and again down the second column. Personally,
CSS is my prefered way to control the layout.

Carolyn

 

[Richard]

There are a number of ways you can do it, but be warned, if your 'pages'
are taller than the viewing window, we may have to scroll down the first
column, then scroll back up and again down the second column. Personally,
CSS is my prefered way to control the layout.

Carolyn

OH MY GAWD!
This site has a damn scroll bar. I'm outa here.
Why the hell do we have damn scroll bars at all then?
Is it our fault Webtv doesn't use horizontal scroll bars?

Show me where it is written in any RFC that thou shalt not use horizontal
scroll bars.

 

[Carolyn Marenger]

OH MY GAWD!
This site has a damn scroll bar. I'm outa here.
Why the hell do we have damn scroll bars at all then?
Is it our fault Webtv doesn't use horizontal scroll bars?

Show me where it is written in any RFC that thou shalt not use horizontal
scroll bars.

I don't think that is written anywhere. For my self, I like to make it as
easy as possible for anyone to view my websites. If I want them to use my
service or buy my product, I won't make them work at it to do so.

If I had a retail outlet, I would do what I could to make it easy for the
clients to find what they are looking for, and then procede to the cash
register. Same goes for anything else I want someone to do. I try to
make it as easy as possible for them to do it. I think that they are more
likely to do it, if they don't have to go over hurdles and obstructions.

For that reason, I try to develop fairly compatible websites, that
minimize the work that someone has to do to view the content. In my mind,
part of that is to try to limit scrolling to one direction. Vertical for
text, horizontal when necessary.

Carolyn

 

[Day Brown]

I don't think that is written anywhere. For my self, I like to make it as
easy as possible for anyone to view my websites. If I want them to use my
service or buy my product, I won't make them work at it to do so.

My sentiments exactly. You dont see scroll bars in books.

If I had a retail outlet, I would do what I could to make it easy for the
clients to find what they are looking for, and then procede to the cash
register. Same goes for anything else I want someone to do. I try to
make it as easy as possible for them to do it. I think that they are more
likely to do it, if they don't have to go over hurdles and obstructions.

For that reason, I try to develop fairly compatible websites, that
minimize the work that someone has to do to view the content. In my mind,
part of that is to try to limit scrolling to one direction. Vertical for
text, horizontal when necessary.

The only way I've found to do it, is to lay out the text and then get a
screenshot, and post the .GIF (you dont need many colors with text, so
gif copies are smaller than jpg.)

But even then, when I do <img src=text.gif size=100%>, it dont actually
*do* 100%, I guess because browser windows vary. I'd like it to 'pg dn'
with the key press too, cause its easier than dragging a mouse.

Now that so many have high speed access, it makes sense to me to just
lay out the page *exactly* as I'd like it to appear, and make a graphic
screen shot to show the surfer. Its gonzo easier than messing with CSS
or html tables, frames, etc..

 

[Carolyn Marenger]

My sentiments exactly. You dont see scroll bars in books.
The only way I've found to do it, is to lay out the text and then get a
screenshot, and post the .GIF (you dont need many colors with text, so
gif copies are smaller than jpg.)

But even then, when I do <img src=text.gif size=100%>, it dont actually
*do* 100%, I guess because browser windows vary. I'd like it to 'pg dn'
with the key press too, cause its easier than dragging a mouse.

Now that so many have high speed access, it makes sense to me to just
lay out the page *exactly* as I'd like it to appear, and make a graphic
screen shot to show the surfer. Its gonzo easier than messing with CSS
or html tables, frames, etc..

That is your choice. I don't choose that option for a number of reasons.
Screen sizes still vary, windows sizes always vary according to user
preferences, language conversion utilities don't convert the language in a
graphic, and so forth. Being multi-lingual (sort of), I try to develop
websites in English first, then with French and German translated pages in
them. That ends up being alot of graphics, if I were to do it your way.

Carolyn

 

[Fat Sam]

OH MY GAWD!
This site has a damn scroll bar. I'm outa here.
Why the hell do we have damn scroll bars at all then?

To allow web visitors to view websites that were designed by people with
no consideration for others....

Show me where it is written in any RFC that thou shalt not use horizontal
scroll bars.

It's a matter of aesthetics and ease-of-use.....Horisontal scrollbars
look untidy and amateurish, and make it more difficult to view a page
all-at-once....

By your argument, magazine publishers shouldn't worry about fitting
articles successfully into the confines of their magazine pages, as they
can simply include a few loose leaf pages written in blue crayon....

 

[Toby Inkster]

Show me where it is written in any RFC that thou shalt not use
horizontal scroll bars.

To an extent I agree with you there.

If horizontal scroll bars were so horrible, then all browser makers would
implement something like Opera's "medium screen rendering" feature.

There's nothing wrong with horizontal scroll bars.

However, scrolling from side to side continuously to read a block of text
sux0rs.

 

[Day Brown]

By your argument, magazine publishers shouldn't worry about fitting
articles successfully into the confines of their magazine pages, as they
can simply include a few loose leaf pages written in blue crayon....

Agreed. There's a *reason* that magazines and newspapers use narrow
columns; its the same reason that Chinese text has been printed in
vertical rectangular blocks for 1000 years. It has to do with the
muscles of the eye, and the registration errors which occur when
you read long lines of html text scrolling across the screen, and
begin reading the wrong line.

http://anzi.hypertech.net shows some of my ongoing efforts to come
up with solutions. No scrollbars.

Part of the problem comes from the office environment html, .pdf,
CSS, et al were designed to serve. Most of the effort went into
how to create eye candy for promotional purposes rather than the
logically consistent presentation of long text. Offices run on
memos, not scholarly work. Load Edw. Gibbon's 'The Decline and
Fall of The Roman Empire' into any GUI based text tool, and watch
it bog down. Yet, everyone since the Founding Fathers found his
work worthy of their attention...

I daresay the failure of modern leaders to find time to take on
Gibbon has much to do with the lack of quality.

Agreed that multimedia has its place. But ANZI is an attempt to
work out a mono-media format so the reader can be immersed in a
lengthy work, like a real book. And like a real book present the
content of facing pages. Classic authors routinely used paragraphs
with 4 times the content of the above. Chinese blocks of text had
a couple hundred symbol words. Maybe this is beyond the attention
span of the modern mind, and maybe feedback will suggest what ANZI
texts should look like.

But the only way I could get text to flow, as it does in a real
book, from the bottom of the left hand page to the top of the
right, was write the assembly code to do it. Any other suggestions
will be welcome.