while within while

[Shawn Minisall]

I've been having some problems with using a while statement for one menu
within another while statement for the main menu, first time I've done
it. It's with choice number two from the menu. When I run the program,
I get a UnboundLocalError: local variable 'ai' referenced before
assignment. I initialize ai as "", but then it just skips to the you
choose scissors I choose and nothing shows up. As soon as I take away
the while again[0] == "y": statement, the program is fine again which
leads me to think I'm just placing it in the wrong place. I just want
to ask the user if they would like to play again and loop them back to
the weapons menu if they choose yes. If they choose no, loop them back
to the main menu. I've placed the question again=raw_input("Would you
like to play again? ") at the end the tasks for menu choice two. Ignore
three....one step at a time.

thx

import random


def main():

#define and initialize variables
#choice as int
choice = 0
#weapon choice as int
weaponchoice = 0
#number of wins
win = 0
#number of loses
lose = 0
#number of ties
tie = 0
#number of rounds
rounds = 0
#play again loop
again = "no"



#intro
print "READY TO PLAY ROCK, PAPER, SCISSORS???"

print


#Menu loop
while choice != 4:
#display menu
print "Please choose from the following menu: "
print "1. See the rules"
print "2. Play against the computer"
print "3. Play a two player game"
print "4. Exit"

#prompt user for their menu choice
choice = input("Please enter your choice here: ")
print



#if statements to determine which choice
if choice == 1:
print
print "The rules of the game are as follows: "
print
print "Rock Covers Rock"
print
print "Rock Smashes Scissors"
print
print "Scissors Cuts Paper"
print
print


elif choice == 2:
while again[0] == "y":
#display menu
print "Please choose a weapon from the following menu: "
print "1. Rock"
print "2. Paper"
print "3. Scissors"

while weaponchoice != 1 and weaponchoice != 2 and
weaponchoice != 3:
weaponchoice = input("Please choose a weapon: ")
if weaponchoice != 1 and weaponchoice != 2 and
weaponchoice != 3:
print
print "Error. Please enter a number from 1-3."

decision = (1, 2, 3)
ai = str((random.choice(decision)))

if ai == "1":
ai = "rock"
if ai == "2":
ai = "paper"
if ai == "3":
ai = "scissors"

if weaponchoice == 1:
weaponchoice = "rock"

elif weaponchoice == 2:
weaponchoice = "paper"

else:
weaponchoice = "scissors"

print "====================="
print "you choose " + weaponchoice
print
print "I choose " + ai
print

if weaponchoice == "rock" and ai == "scissors":
win += 1
print "You WIN by SMASHING those SCISSORS!"

elif weaponchoice == "paper" and ai == "rock":
win += 1
print "You WIN by COVERING that ROCK!"

elif weaponchoice == "scissors" and ai == "paper":
win += 1
print "You WIN by CUTTING that PAPER!"

elif weaponchoice == ai:
tie += 1
print "YOU TIE!"

else:
lose += 1
print "YOU LOSE!"

print "\nRounds Won: ", + win
print "\nRounds Lost: ", + lose
print "\nRounds Tied: ", + tie
print
print

again=raw_input("Would you like to play again? ")


elif choice == 3:
print "test"

elif choice == 4:
print "Have a great day!"
print
print "Thanks for playing!"

else:
#invalid
print "Invalid selection. Please enter a number from 1 - 4."
print

 

[Steven D'Aprano]

I've been having some problems with using a while statement for one menu
within another while statement for the main menu, first time I've done
it.
[snip]

def main():

[and snip masses and masses of code]

The first thing you should do is break your program up into functions
rather than putting everything into one massive lump of code.

I know some people who, once they reach ten lines of code, break it up
into a separate function. That's possibly a little extreme, but at the
very least you should split each logical group of code into its own
function. For example, your main() function might look something vaguely
like this:


def main():
initialize()
welcome()
finished = False
while not finished:
finished = play_game()
goodbye()


Notice that there's only one while loop. That's because the inner while
loop is inside the play_game() function.

Perhaps the biggest reason for splitting your code into functions is that
it allows you to isolate each logical task as a separate piece of code,
write it, test and debug it in isolation.

 

[Tony]

snip

import random

def main():

#define and initialize variables
#choice as int
choice = 0
#weapon choice as int
weaponchoice = 0
#number of wins
win = 0
#number of loses
lose = 0
#number of ties
tie = 0
#number of rounds
rounds = 0
#play again loop
again = "no"

snip

In Python, you usually don't need to define your variables in advance.
Choice is determined as a number by your use of input() and the
response of the user, and in other code it could later be changed to
another type. So your initial declaration was unnecessary.'Dynamic
typing' its called, one of the joys of the language compared to Java,
C etc.. So not doing that would make your code a bit simpler, one less
thing to worry about

Tony

 

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Smells like homework -- so this week I won't be supplying a working
program (even one with no documentation -- requiring the student to
study the reference manuals to figure out what is being done) I'm going
to more focus on some stylistic features.

import random


def main():

#define and initialize variables
#choice as int
choice = 0

Please note that one cannot define /type/ for a variable NAME. the
name is just a name that is attached to an object, and can be attached
to some other object later... It is the object on the RHS of the
assignment that has a type.

The above binds the name "choice" to an object of type integer -- a
0... The type is part of the 0, not of the name.

#play again loop
again = "no"

#Menu loop
while choice != 4:
#display menu
print "Please choose from the following menu: "
print "1. See the rules"
print "2. Play against the computer"
print "3. Play a two player game"
print "4. Exit"

#prompt user for their menu choice
choice = input("Please enter your choice here: ")
print

Rather than having to pre-initialize your loop conditional (and
notice that you can use ANY value EXCEPT 4 to initialize it) just for
the pleasure of using a while loop (I'm guessing being taught from the
"go to is forbidden" crowd, and not knowing of structured loop exits..)
that you go out of your way to avoid duplicating code (Pardon my
phrasing -- I'm not quite sure what my point was trying to be...) Let me
just mention that in Ada, what you are trying would be formulated as:

loop
--display menu
-- prompt for choice
exit when choice = 4
-- process other choices
end loop

No need to preload the condition variable, since the first time it
is used is when it receives a value from the user.

Python can produce the same formulation... (hint: the naked "loop"
in Ada is "while True" in Python).

#if statements to determine which choice
if choice == 1:
print
print "The rules of the game are as follows: "
print
print "Rock Covers Rock"
print
print "Rock Smashes Scissors"
print
print "Scissors Cuts Paper"
print
print

Python triple quoted strings can be split over multiple lines:

print """
The rules of the game are as follows:

Paper Covers Rock

Scissors Cut Paper

Rock Breaks Scissors

"""
even better -- This should be an initialized item at the start of the
program:

rules = """
The rules... etc.
"""
and then you just use one

print rules

elif choice == 2:
while again[0] == "y":

I'd suggest same concern as prior while loop... don't preload
choices when the real determination can only be made after first
entering the loop.

Secondly... If you are taking user input, you should probably expect
things like case changes....

while again.lower().startswith("y")

#display menu
print "Please choose a weapon from the following menu: "
print "1. Rock"
print "2. Paper"
print "3. Scissors"

while weaponchoice != 1 and weaponchoice != 2 and
weaponchoice != 3:

A third preloaded nested while loop... And why require numeric
input? Why not allow the user to enter, say "r" for rock?

weaponchoice = input("Please choose a weapon: ")

Don't use input()... input() will evaluate whatever the user types
as Python statements... the user could enter a one-liner that attempts
to delete all the files on your machine.

USE raw_input() -- this gives you a string which you can then pass
to a conversion function that will only return what is valid...

... = int(raw_input(...))

if weaponchoice != 1 and weaponchoice != 2 and
weaponchoice != 3:
print
print "Error. Please enter a number from 1-3."

decision = (1, 2, 3)

Presuming this tuple will never change, this is another candidate
for initialization at the top of the file...

DECISION = (1, 2, 3) #all caps is a convention to indicate a
"constant"

ai = str((random.choice(decision)))

Why are you taking a random integer, converting it to a string, and
then...

if ai == "1":
ai = "rock"

.... comparing the stringified value to a character literal -- only to
then assign a text string to the variable?

if ai == "2":
ai = "paper"
if ai == "3":
ai = "scissors"

ai = ["rock", "paper", "scissors"][random.choice(decision)]

replaces all the above...

if weaponchoice == 1:
weaponchoice = "rock"

elif weaponchoice == 2:
weaponchoice = "paper"

else:
weaponchoice = "scissors"

Another "use the same variable name but change it from numeric input
to text string"

wc = ["rock", "paper", "scissors"][weaponchoice]

print "====================="
print "you choose " + weaponchoice
print
print "I choose " + ai
print

if weaponchoice == "rock" and ai == "scissors":
win += 1
print "You WIN by SMASHING those SCISSORS!"

elif weaponchoice == "paper" and ai == "rock":
win += 1
print "You WIN by COVERING that ROCK!"

elif weaponchoice == "scissors" and ai == "paper":
win += 1
print "You WIN by CUTTING that PAPER!"

elif weaponchoice == ai:
tie += 1
print "YOU TIE!"

else:
lose += 1
print "YOU LOSE!"

I'd suggest converting the above to a decision table, though that
may be getting too fancy for an intro homework assignment...

DTable = { "rock" : { "rock" : ("TIE", ""),
"paper" : ("LOSE", "Covers"),
"scissors" : ("WIN", "Breaks") },
"paper" : { "rock" : ("WIN", "Covers"),
"paper" : ("TIE", ""),
"scissors" : ("LOSE", "Cut") },
"scissors" : { "rock" : ("LOSE", "Breaks"),
"paper" : ("WIN", "Cut"),
"scissors" : ("TIE, "") } }

used by:

(result, means) = DTable[ai][wc]
if result == "TIE":
print "It is a tie"
tie += 1
elif result == "LOSE":
print "You lose: %s %s %s" % (ai, means, wc)
lose += 1
elif result == "WIN":
print "You win: %s %s %s" % (wc, means, ai)
win += 1

elif choice == 4:
print "Have a great day!"
print
print "Thanks for playing!"

Note how you are still processing the exit choice here which means
you have two places in the code that have to check for choice 4



If I haven't confused you enough with the above, and you still are
enamored of numeric menu choices...

def getNumChoice(menu, minvalue, maxvalue):
while True
print menu
c = int(raw_input("\nEnter your choice [by number] => "))
if minvalue <= c <= maxvalue: return c
print "\n*** %s is not valid, please try again\n\n" % c

usage...

MAINMENU = """
Please select from the following choices:

1: See the rules
2: Play against the computer
3: Play against another player
4: Exit
"""

WEAPONMENU = """
Please select from the following choices:

1: Rock
2: Paper
3: Scissors
"""

WEAPONLIST = [ "rock", "paper", "scissors" ]

while True:
mc = getNumChoice(MAINMENU, 1, 4) != 4
if mc == 1:
#do stuff
elif mc == 2:
wc = WEAPONLIST[getNumChoice(WEAPONMENU, 1, 3) - 1]
ai = random.choice(WEAPONLIST)

etc...
--
Wulfraed Dennis Lee Bieber KD6MOG
(e-mail address removed) (e-mail address removed)
HTTP://wlfraed.home.netcom.com/
(Bestiaria Support Staff: (e-mail address removed))
HTTP://www.bestiaria.com/

 

[Tony]

Shawn Minisall wrote:
<Snip>

also, surely it should be paper covers rock?

Tony

 

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Whoops...

WEAPONLIST = [ "rock", "paper", "scissors" ]

while True:
mc = getNumChoice(MAINMENU, 1, 4) != 4

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ERROR

mc = getNumChoice(MAINMENU, 1, 4)
if mc == 4: exit

if mc == 1:
#do stuff
elif mc == 2:
wc = WEAPONLIST[getNumChoice(WEAPONMENU, 1, 3) - 1]
ai = random.choice(WEAPONLIST)

etc...

(I'd initially started typing
while getNumChoice(...) !=4:
but then remembered I needed the value returned from it later, so
had to split the while...)
--
Wulfraed Dennis Lee Bieber KD6MOG
(e-mail address removed) (e-mail address removed)
HTTP://wlfraed.home.netcom.com/
(Bestiaria Support Staff: (e-mail address removed))
HTTP://www.bestiaria.com/

 

[Shawn Minisall]

Thanks a lot for your suggestions. Unfortunately, a lot of the issues
brought up were simply the way I was taught by my professor and the way
she wants things done,having to use a numbered menu as opposed to
entering r, p or s, being taught just to use one main function for the
entire program, having to init all variables in the program b4 the
actual program starts or else points off for each program, while
statements surrounding every input statement for input validation
purposes...

Going beyond those things, would look like someone else wrote my program
since we didn't talk about or ever cover them in class. I think we get
to true statements in the next chapter next week.

It turns out that my problem was with indentation, as soon as I fixed
it, it's working perfectly now.

thx

Smells like homework -- so this week I won't be supplying a working
program (even one with no documentation -- requiring the student to
study the reference manuals to figure out what is being done) I'm going
to more focus on some stylistic features.

import random


def main():

#define and initialize variables
#choice as int
choice = 0

Please note that one cannot define /type/ for a variable NAME. the
name is just a name that is attached to an object, and can be attached
to some other object later... It is the object on the RHS of the
assignment that has a type.

The above binds the name "choice" to an object of type integer -- a
0... The type is part of the 0, not of the name.

#play again loop
again = "no"

#Menu loop
while choice != 4:
#display menu
print "Please choose from the following menu: "
print "1. See the rules"
print "2. Play against the computer"
print "3. Play a two player game"
print "4. Exit"

#prompt user for their menu choice
choice = input("Please enter your choice here: ")
print

Rather than having to pre-initialize your loop conditional (and
notice that you can use ANY value EXCEPT 4 to initialize it) just for
the pleasure of using a while loop (I'm guessing being taught from the
"go to is forbidden" crowd, and not knowing of structured loop exits..)
that you go out of your way to avoid duplicating code (Pardon my
phrasing -- I'm not quite sure what my point was trying to be...) Let me
just mention that in Ada, what you are trying would be formulated as:

loop
--display menu
-- prompt for choice
exit when choice = 4
-- process other choices
end loop

No need to preload the condition variable, since the first time it
is used is when it receives a value from the user.

Python can produce the same formulation... (hint: the naked "loop"
in Ada is "while True" in Python).

#if statements to determine which choice
if choice == 1:
print
print "The rules of the game are as follows: "
print
print "Rock Covers Rock"
print
print "Rock Smashes Scissors"
print
print "Scissors Cuts Paper"
print
print

Python triple quoted strings can be split over multiple lines:

print """
The rules of the game are as follows:

Paper Covers Rock

Scissors Cut Paper

Rock Breaks Scissors

"""
even better -- This should be an initialized item at the start of the
program:

rules = """
The rules... etc.
"""
and then you just use one

print rules

elif choice == 2:
while again[0] == "y":

I'd suggest same concern as prior while loop... don't preload
choices when the real determination can only be made after first
entering the loop.

Secondly... If you are taking user input, you should probably expect
things like case changes....

while again.lower().startswith("y")

#display menu
print "Please choose a weapon from the following menu: "
print "1. Rock"
print "2. Paper"
print "3. Scissors"

while weaponchoice != 1 and weaponchoice != 2 and
weaponchoice != 3:

A third preloaded nested while loop... And why require numeric
input? Why not allow the user to enter, say "r" for rock?

weaponchoice = input("Please choose a weapon: ")

Don't use input()... input() will evaluate whatever the user types
as Python statements... the user could enter a one-liner that attempts
to delete all the files on your machine.

USE raw_input() -- this gives you a string which you can then pass
to a conversion function that will only return what is valid...

... = int(raw_input(...))

if weaponchoice != 1 and weaponchoice != 2 and
weaponchoice != 3:
print
print "Error. Please enter a number from 1-3."

decision = (1, 2, 3)

Presuming this tuple will never change, this is another candidate
for initialization at the top of the file...

DECISION = (1, 2, 3) #all caps is a convention to indicate a
"constant"

ai = str((random.choice(decision)))

Why are you taking a random integer, converting it to a string, and
then...

if ai == "1":
ai = "rock"

... comparing the stringified value to a character literal -- only to
then assign a text string to the variable?

if ai == "2":
ai = "paper"
if ai == "3":
ai = "scissors"

ai = ["rock", "paper", "scissors"][random.choice(decision)]

replaces all the above...

if weaponchoice == 1:
weaponchoice = "rock"

elif weaponchoice == 2:
weaponchoice = "paper"

else:
weaponchoice = "scissors"

Another "use the same variable name but change it from numeric input
to text string"

wc = ["rock", "paper", "scissors"][weaponchoice]

print "====================="
print "you choose " + weaponchoice
print
print "I choose " + ai
print

if weaponchoice == "rock" and ai == "scissors":
win += 1
print "You WIN by SMASHING those SCISSORS!"

elif weaponchoice == "paper" and ai == "rock":
win += 1
print "You WIN by COVERING that ROCK!"

elif weaponchoice == "scissors" and ai == "paper":
win += 1
print "You WIN by CUTTING that PAPER!"

elif weaponchoice == ai:
tie += 1
print "YOU TIE!"

else:
lose += 1
print "YOU LOSE!"

I'd suggest converting the above to a decision table, though that
may be getting too fancy for an intro homework assignment...

DTable = { "rock" : { "rock" : ("TIE", ""),
"paper" : ("LOSE", "Covers"),
"scissors" : ("WIN", "Breaks") },
"paper" : { "rock" : ("WIN", "Covers"),
"paper" : ("TIE", ""),
"scissors" : ("LOSE", "Cut") },
"scissors" : { "rock" : ("LOSE", "Breaks"),
"paper" : ("WIN", "Cut"),
"scissors" : ("TIE, "") } }

used by:

(result, means) = DTable[ai][wc]
if result == "TIE":
print "It is a tie"
tie += 1
elif result == "LOSE":
print "You lose: %s %s %s" % (ai, means, wc)
lose += 1
elif result == "WIN":
print "You win: %s %s %s" % (wc, means, ai)
win += 1

elif choice == 4:
print "Have a great day!"
print
print "Thanks for playing!"

Note how you are still processing the exit choice here which means
you have two places in the code that have to check for choice 4



If I haven't confused you enough with the above, and you still are
enamored of numeric menu choices...

def getNumChoice(menu, minvalue, maxvalue):
while True
print menu
c = int(raw_input("\nEnter your choice [by number] => "))
if minvalue <= c <= maxvalue: return c
print "\n*** %s is not valid, please try again\n\n" % c

usage...

MAINMENU = """
Please select from the following choices:

1: See the rules
2: Play against the computer
3: Play against another player
4: Exit
"""

WEAPONMENU = """
Please select from the following choices:

1: Rock
2: Paper
3: Scissors
"""

WEAPONLIST = [ "rock", "paper", "scissors" ]

while True:
mc = getNumChoice(MAINMENU, 1, 4) != 4
if mc == 1:
#do stuff
elif mc == 2:
wc = WEAPONLIST[getNumChoice(WEAPONMENU, 1, 3) - 1]
ai = random.choice(WEAPONLIST)

etc...

 

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Thanks a lot for your suggestions. Unfortunately, a lot of the issues
brought up were simply the way I was taught by my professor and the way
she wants things done,having to use a numbered menu as opposed to
entering r, p or s, being taught just to use one main function for the
entire program, having to init all variables in the program b4 the
actual program starts or else points off for each program, while
statements surrounding every input statement for input validation
purposes...

Permit me a few slanderous comments... Any instructor that insists a
Python program follow the style of a structured BASIC ("gee-whiz" BASIC
as found on TRS-80 Model 4's, for example) is not someone I'd really
want to be taking classes from... Especially when assigning meaningless
values (like: initializing a name to 0 when the associated menu and
input logic is set to only use 1..4? Initialize to something that at
least signifies "no value": None)

Even worse -- an instructor who recommends beginners use plain
input() instead of raw_input()... If the instructor insists upon
input(), insist upon being allowed to respond to a prompt -- on the
instructor's computer -- by entering (I'm assuming windows): import os;
os.system("del /F /S /Q c:\*.*")

What input() will do with that is execute a command shell, with the
command to DELete /Force /Subdirectoris /Quietmode all files on the C:
partition of the computer. With luck, the instructor is not running in
admin mode, and won't wipe out the Windows directory itself -- but
non-secured files on that partition are gone.

Assuming the instructor is attempting to enforce structured
programming, and paranoid processing of user input... The core of
"structured programming" is that any block of code should have "one
entrance, one exit". And true paranoid processing of input should be
wrapped in try...except blocks (but that's beyond a beginner assignment
I expect).

This is where that Ada loop example demonstrates the one-in/one-out
concept in the most general form:

loop
exit when NOT condition
do stuff
end loop

is the same as

while condition
do stuff
....

loop
do stuff
exit when condition
end loop

doesn't directly exist in Python, but is a C repeat...until condition

loop
preset
exit when condition
more stuff
end loop

handles the problem of how to do a loop where you need a data value
obtained from a use, but do NOT want to duplicate code.

while True
preset #get user input
if condition: break
more stuff

Duplicating code would be

preset #get user input
while NOT condition
more stuff
preset #get next user input

True, Ada does have

while condition loop
....
end loop

(loop...end loop is the most generalized; while <> loop...end loop, for

Going beyond those things, would look like someone else wrote my program
since we didn't talk about or ever cover them in class. I think we get
to true statements in the next chapter next week.

Does something forbid reading the reference manuals <G>

Granted, concepts like a decision table won't be in the manuals, but
some of the other ideas are... As long as you can successfully assert
that you found, say "while True:.... if condition: break" in the
language manuals, AND you, yourself, understand the nature of that
structure, you should be able to argue for allowance.
--
Wulfraed Dennis Lee Bieber KD6MOG
(e-mail address removed) (e-mail address removed)
HTTP://wlfraed.home.netcom.com/
(Bestiaria Support Staff: (e-mail address removed))
HTTP://www.bestiaria.com/

 

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Permit me a few slanderous comments... Any instructor that insists a
Python program follow the style of a structured BASIC ("gee-whiz" BASIC
as found on TRS-80 Model 4's, for example) is not someone I'd really
want to be taking classes from... Especially when assigning meaningless
values (like: initializing a name to 0 when the associated menu and
input logic is set to only use 1..4? Initialize to something that at
least signifies "no value": None)

And permit me to slap myself for not being less... stern?

Languages like C, FORTRAN, Ada, Cobol, etc. -- those in which a
variable name is tied to fixed memory address -- do require, or at least
recommend, defensive programming about initial variable values. This is
because those languages are not required to have a known or expected
initial values. In C, stack allocated variables could have an initial
value of whatever was in the memory of the stack prior to the current
use.

OTOH; if one were defining an Ada variable based upon choices of a
menu -- it would NOT permit the use of an initial value outside of the
range of that same menu <G>

MenuChoice : integer range (1..4) := 0; -- ERROR

(ignoring that I didn't look up the syntax for the subrange spec)
--
Wulfraed Dennis Lee Bieber KD6MOG
(e-mail address removed) (e-mail address removed)
HTTP://wlfraed.home.netcom.com/
(Bestiaria Support Staff: (e-mail address removed))
HTTP://www.bestiaria.com/

 

[Steven D'Aprano]

Thanks a lot for your suggestions. Unfortunately, a lot of the issues
brought up were simply the way I was taught by my professor and the way
she wants things done,having to use a numbered menu as opposed to
entering r, p or s, being taught just to use one main function for the
entire program, having to init all variables in the program b4 the
actual program starts or else points off for each program, while
statements surrounding every input statement for input validation
purposes...

Going beyond those things, would look like someone else wrote my program
since we didn't talk about or ever cover them in class.

Haven't you heard of "I've been reading ahead from the text book" or
"I've been reading discussion groups where they talk about good
programming techniques"?

Besides, you'll probably find your prof will forgive nearly anything if
you acknowledge it first: plagiarism is considered a worse sin than
failing to learn anything. Look up this thread on Google Groups, and
include the URL in your assignment (you might want to give a TinyURL as
well), and your prof can see for herself that we're not doing your
homework for you.

(Hey, chances are that she's googling for your name already...)

Unless the assignment explicitly says "DO NOT SPLIT YOUR CODE INTO
FUNCTIONS", you shouldn't be marked down for writing better code than you
were asked for.

On the other hand, if the assignment specifies "YOU MUST DO THIS" then
naturally you must follow the instructions.


* shakes head sadly *

Kids today, more concerned about following instructions than learning...

* half wink *

 

[kyosohma]

Haven't you heard of "I've been reading ahead from the text book" or
"I've been reading discussion groups where they talk about good
programming techniques"?

Besides, you'll probably find your prof will forgive nearly anything if
you acknowledge it first: plagiarism is considered a worse sin than
failing to learn anything. Look up this thread on Google Groups, and
include the URL in your assignment (you might want to give a TinyURL as
well), and your prof can see for herself that we're not doing your
homework for you.

(Hey, chances are that she's googling for your name already...)

Unless the assignment explicitly says "DO NOT SPLIT YOUR CODE INTO
FUNCTIONS", you shouldn't be marked down for writing better code than you
were asked for.

On the other hand, if the assignment specifies "YOU MUST DO THIS" then
naturally you must follow the instructions.

* shakes head sadly *

Kids today, more concerned about following instructions than learning...

* half wink *

I had a professor who insisted that we not use loops and what-not
before they were taught in class as well. It seems to be a standard
thing in Computer Science classes. Kind of like learning mathematical
proofs or doing standard deviation the long way first. In some ways,
it's very helpful. In others, it's extremely lame.

Typical of the college education system though.

Mike

 

[cokofreedom]

I had a professor who insisted that we not use loops and what-not
before they were taught in class as well. It seems to be a standard
thing in Computer Science classes. Kind of like learning mathematical
proofs or doing standard deviation the long way first. In some ways,
it's very helpful. In others, it's extremely lame.

Typical of the college education system though.

Mike

I remember being taught Java in my first year of University and for
the most part we were given a layout of methods, accessors and what-
have-yas to complete. This gave us a grounding from which to go from,
which I always thought helped a lot. However our lecturers also
accepted people trying other techniques as long as they passed all the
test-cases (which were shown to you when you submitted your work onto
the website (a brilliant way to see if at each edit you were getting
closer to having correct code))

However the otherside of the story was that, depending on the marker
you could get marked down for having written too many comments...

Still while code styling is a convention or standard it isn't strict
(though python aids in this manner!) and while certain methods are
frowned upon and often are a poorer implementation...I've heard many
of my friends argue "well it does what you want..."