&ensp in a monospaced font

[Jukka K. Korpela]

Scripsit Ben C:

Well it says in 16.6.3 that "Control characters other than tab,
line-feed, space and bidi formatting characters are treated as
characters to render in the same way as any normal character".

You can probably explain better what that means, but as far as I can
tell, implementors are meant to leave the non-breaking spaces in.

It's an absurdity, since control characters proper cannot be rendered as
normal characters. By definition, they have control functions, not
visible rendering. Whether spaces are control characters is a matter of
definition.

This isn't the only part in the CSS 2.1 draft that is hopelessly messy
and obscure, especially if taken as an attempt to dictate what happens
in processing HTML documents in general, rather than as relating
(somehow) to the CSS property being discussed there.

 

[Harlan Messinger]

Vim does it.
If I start a new sentence here, and then gq the two lines, I get this:

"Vim does it. If I start a new sentence here, and then gq the two lines,
I get this:"

Vim is a text editor designed for use with a monospace font.

 

[Ben C]

Scripsit Ben C:


It's an absurdity, since control characters proper cannot be rendered as
normal characters. By definition, they have control functions, not
visible rendering.

That was exactly the problem I was having making sense of it.

Whether spaces are control characters is a matter of definition.

I tend to think of a space not as something you render with a (blank)
glyph but as an instruction to put a gap between glyphs. This makes it
easier to deal with line-breaking because you have the same number of
glyphs regardless of where the lines break.

This isn't the only part in the CSS 2.1 draft that is hopelessly messy
and obscure, especially if taken as an attempt to dictate what happens
in processing HTML documents in general, rather than as relating
(somehow) to the CSS property being discussed there.

If it means anything I think it does basically mean don't collapse
non-breaking spaces given that it's in the section on white-space
collapsing. But I agree it is rather obscure.

 

[Harlan Messinger]

I understand all of that. But, for those of us who learned to touch
type in 1963 it's nearly impossible to break the habit of hitting the
space bar twice after a period.

Really? I managed it over 15 years ago, as soon as proportional fonts
became available to me (after having been touch-typing since 1974).

In any event, the OP wrote that he'd love to see the spacing *displayed*
as two spaces. If he were coming from where you are, I'd expect the
question to be, "Help, I can't stop putting two spaces after a period.
How can I get them to display as a single space?" followed by, "Oh,
wonderful, HTML does that automatically!"

 

[Harlan Messinger]

<ot> Are there other English words that contain a consecutive triplet of
doubled letters?

Bookkeeping.

 

[Harlan Messinger]

Good question, the answer is no!

These are all the ones I could find in the Scrabble dictionary of
pointless but high-scoring words and various other word lists I have on
my computer:

bookkeeper
bookkeepers
bookkeeping
bookkeeping

I will leave the regular expression to find them as an exercise to the
reader.

^.*(.)\1(.)\2(.)\3.*$

 

[Blinky the Shark]

Well just remember that not everybody has the same wierd problems you old
guys have...

Yeah, the other day......uh......HEY!

 

[Neredbojias]

Yeah, the other day......uh......HEY!

<grin /> Oops, I mean <grin>lips</grin>

 

[Ben C]

^.*(.)\1(.)\2(.)\3.*$

That's it. I felt compelled to try a Dutch word list for some richer
piicckkings.

aaneennaai
aaneennaaide
aaneennaaiden
aaneennaaien
aaneennaait
aannaai
aannaaide
aannaaiden
aannaaien
aannaaiend
aannaait
aanneem
aanneembaar
aanneembare
aanneemsom
aanneemsommen
aanneemster
aanneemsters
aanneemt
actievoorraad
beheerraad
bevoorraad
bevoorraadde
bevoorraadden
bevoorraadt
borduurraam
buffervoorraad
dooddeel
dooddeelde
dooddeelden
dooddeelt
doorreed
doorrook
doorrookt
doorrookte
doorrookten
doorrookter
doorrooktst
dwaalleer
eerroof
figuurraadsel
figuurraadsels
goederenvoorraad
goudvoorraad
hamstervoorraad
hooggaand
hooggaande
hooggaander
hooggaandere
hooggaandst
hooggaandste
ijzervoorraad
kasvoorraad
koollaag
leeggooi
leeggooide
leeggooiden
leeggooien
leeggooit
leeggoot
maalloon
materiaalleer
mondvoorraad
muntvoorraad
nooddoop
noodvoorraad
overreedde
overreedden
plaaggeest
plaaggeesten
reservevoorraad
restantvoorraad
spreekkoor
spreekuurrooster
steekkaart
steekkaarten
steenkoollaag
straattaal
stuurreep
tamboereerraam
teellaag
toneellaars
toneellaarzen
uiteenneem
uiteenneembaar
uiteenneembare
uiteenneemt
uurrooster
uurroosters
verraadde
verraadden
vertaalloon
voedselvoorraad
voorraad
voorraadadministratie
voorraadaftrek
voorraadbeheer
voorraadbeheersing
voorraadbestand
voorraadbewaking
voorraadboek
voorraadboeken
voorraadcontrole
voorraadgegevens
voorraadhoeveelheden
voorraadhoudende
voorraadhuis
voorraadhuizen
voorraadje
voorraadkaart
voorraadkaarten
voorraadkamer
voorraadkamers
voorraadkast
voorraadkosten
voorraadniveau
voorraadpeil
voorraadrekening
voorraadschuren
voorraadschuur
voorraadtank
voorraadtanks
voorraadvat
voorraadvorming
voorraam
voorreed
vuurrood
vuurroodst
weekkaart
weekkaarten
winkelvoorraad
wintervoorraad
woordvoorraad
woordvoorraaden
zoolleer

 

[Els]

That's it. I felt compelled to try a Dutch word list for some richer
piicckkings.

aaneennaai
aaneennaaide

[snip]

That's cheating though! Dutch even has a word with 8 consonents in
a row... (and yes, it can be pronounced)

 

[Harlan Messinger]

That's cheating though! Dutch even has a word with 8 consonents in
a row... (and yes, it can be pronounced)

All I can come up with off the top of my head is geslachtsschreven, if
by any chance that means "writing pornographic novels".

 

[Els]

All I can come up with off the top of my head is geslachtsschreven, if
by any chance that means "writing pornographic novels".

<g>
No, it doesn't mean that, and I doubt it even exists. The word 'writing'
is 'schrijven', but even if I substitute that, I never heard of it, the
word itself doesn't make sense, and the online dictionary doesn't have
it.

The word I meant is 'angstschreeuw'. Noun, 'scream of fear'.

 

[Blinky the Shark]

That's it. I felt compelled to try a Dutch word list for some richer
piicckkings.

aaneennaai
aaneennaaide

[snip]

That's cheating though! Dutch even has a word with 8 consonents in
a row... (and yes, it can be pronounced)

Not by terrestrials, it can't.

 

[Blinky the Shark]

<g>
No, it doesn't mean that, and I doubt it even exists. The word 'writing'
is 'schrijven', but even if I substitute that, I never heard of it, the
word itself doesn't make sense, and the online dictionary doesn't have
it.

The word I meant is 'angstschreeuw'. Noun, 'scream of fear'.

Here it is with *no* consonants:

IIEEEEEE!

 

[Stan Brown]

Just out of interest, what is the logic behind collapsing spaces in text?
I'd love to be able to display a document I'd written with the conventional
2 spaces after a full stop.

Two spaces is *not* conventional after a full stop, any more than
"between he and I" is conventional in grammar. It is a common error,
and that's all.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com/
HTML 4.01 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/
validator: http://validator.w3.org/
CSS 2.1 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/
validator: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/
Why We Won't Help You:
http://diveintomark.org/archives/2003/05/05/why_we_wont_help_you

 

[Stan Brown]

Vim does it.
If I start a new sentence here, and then gq the two lines, I get this:

"Vim does it. If I start a new sentence here, and then gq the two lines,
I get this:"

Two spaces after the '.' There's no doubt an option somewhere to change
it to 1 or 3 spaces or any arbitary string but I just live with it as it
is.

I've been using Vim for many years, and I can assure you that is not
default behavior. You, or someone on your behalf, may have set up
some sort of mapping.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com/
HTML 4.01 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/
validator: http://validator.w3.org/
CSS 2.1 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/
validator: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/
Why We Won't Help You:
http://diveintomark.org/archives/2003/05/05/why_we_wont_help_you

 

[Michael Fesser]

..oO(Els)

<g>
No, it doesn't mean that, and I doubt it even exists. The word 'writing'
is 'schrijven', but even if I substitute that, I never heard of it, the
word itself doesn't make sense, and the online dictionary doesn't have
it.

The word I meant is 'angstschreeuw'. Noun, 'scream of fear'.

"Angstschrei" in German, quite similar.

Micha

 

[Ed Mullen]

Really? I managed it over 15 years ago, as soon as proportional fonts
became available to me (after having been touch-typing since 1974).

Gee, 11 years after I learned. Maybe those extra 11 years were a
stronger imprinting on my brain? ;-)

In any event, the OP wrote that he'd love to see the spacing *displayed*
as two spaces. If he were coming from where you are, I'd expect the
question to be, "Help, I can't stop putting two spaces after a period.
How can I get them to display as a single space?" followed by, "Oh,
wonderful, HTML does that automatically!"

I took it to mean that he types two spaces and he wishes HTML did not
compress it to a single displayed space, that what he types would be
displayed as he typed it.

At least I've learned to not care when composing HTML text. I type two
spaces and know that it will display as one. Hey, it's not paper, it's
the Web. Ok. Fine, my HTML pages contain a few more bytes in
undisplayable spaces. Even on a 56k dial-up link the extra weight is
probably unmeasurable.

And I've also learned that if I want more than one space, as in two or
more, to display, I do something else more appropriate to HTML and
browser display.

I'm not inflexible. My fingers may be when lightly resting on a QWERTY
keyboard, but other than that?

Still don't have a clue why (or what the logic was that said) the
decision was: "If one space exists, display one space. If two or more
consecutive spaces exist, display one space." Huh?

 

[Harlan Messinger]

<g>
No, it doesn't mean that, and I doubt it even exists. The word 'writing'
is 'schrijven', but even if I substitute that, I never heard of it, the
word itself doesn't make sense, and the online dictionary doesn't have
it.

The word I meant is 'angstschreeuw'. Noun, 'scream of fear'.

 

[Harlan Messinger]

<g>
No, it doesn't mean that, and I doubt it even exists. The word 'writing'
is 'schrijven', but even if I substitute that, I never heard of it, the
word itself doesn't make sense, and the online dictionary doesn't have
it.

The word I meant is 'angstschreeuw'. Noun, 'scream of fear'.

See, I knew "schr" had to be involved.