Looking for an application to help me write HTML

Discussion in 'HTML' started by Bob, Apr 22, 2006.

  1. Bob

    Bob Guest

    What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something like
    the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my HTML like
    a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening tag, or a
    tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character missing or in
    the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my HTML through the
    application and have the program fix tag typos for me. Are there any
    programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut it, cuz it does not
    find errors for me.
     
    Bob, Apr 22, 2006
    #1
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  2. Bob wrote:
    > What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something like
    > the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my HTML like
    > a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening tag, or a
    > tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character missing or in
    > the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my HTML through the
    > application and have the program fix tag typos for me. Are there any
    > programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut it, cuz it does not
    > find errors for me.


    http://validator.w3.org/

    --
    Hywel
     
    Hywel Jenkins, Apr 22, 2006
    #2
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  3. Hywel Jenkins wrote:
    > Bob wrote:
    >> What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something
    >> like the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my
    >> HTML like a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening
    >> tag, or a tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character
    >> missing or in the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my HTML
    >> through the application and have the program fix tag typos for me. Are
    >> there any programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut it, cuz it
    >> does not find errors for me.

    >
    > http://validator.w3.org/
    >


    You could also use a text editor with syntax highlighting which can help
    you quickly identify typos, I personally like freeware Crimson Editor
    http://www.nullsoft.com but there are many out there

    --
    Take care,

    Jonathan
    -------------------
    LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
    http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com
     
    Jonathan N. Little, Apr 22, 2006
    #3
  4. Bob

    Andy Dingley Guest

    On Fri, 21 Apr 2006 22:56:14 -0700, Bob <> wrote:

    >What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something like
    >the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my HTML like
    >a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening tag, or a
    >tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character missing or in
    >the wrong place).


    There aren't many of these, because it's a non -trivial problem to parse
    properly. Some of the older ones aren't all that accurate. Many of them
    today parse XML fine (which is easier) but can't do it for HTML. There
    are still some though, if you look.

    You'd do well do get a copy of HTML Kit for starters, because that
    includes HTML Tidy.

    For issues about appropriate nesting of elements, rather than merey
    syntactic well-formedness, then look for a real validator, like the W3C
    one.

    The are also things like Albert the Spammer's CSE HTML which are _not_
    validators. These should be avoided, because they're not what you need
    at all.
     
    Andy Dingley, Apr 22, 2006
    #4
  5. Andy Dingley wrote:
    <snip>
    > The are also things like Albert the Spammer's CSE HTML which are _not_
    > validators. These should be avoided, because they're not what you need
    > at all.


    I would disagree, yes CSE HTML Validator Lite is a linter not a
    validator but it can have its uses. I have a tweaked copy and it can be
    useful to catch many syntax mistakes. It can be a quick (since it is a
    local program) to precheck a page but you should do the final run
    through a real validator. The little templates macros are not bad,
    certainly better than FP and DW! Lacks syntax highlighting. I don't
    really use it but can be a useful tool. I haven't had any spamming from
    it but maybe my copy is too old.

    --
    Take care,

    Jonathan
    -------------------
    LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
    http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com
     
    Jonathan N. Little, Apr 22, 2006
    #5
  6. Bob

    Bob Guest

    Hywel Jenkins wrote:
    > Bob wrote:
    >> What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something
    >> like the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my
    >> HTML like a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening
    >> tag, or a tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character
    >> missing or in the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my HTML
    >> through the application and have the program fix tag typos for me. Are
    >> there any programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut it, cuz it
    >> does not find errors for me.

    >
    > http://validator.w3.org/


    I want something that fixes local tags, not online tags. I want an
    application that runs on my hard drive so I can check plain text
    documents. I already have the Tidy extension for Firefox but that only
    works on webpages, not text files on my drive.
     
    Bob, Apr 22, 2006
    #6
  7. Bob

    Bob Guest

    Hywel Jenkins wrote:
    > Bob wrote:
    >> What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something
    >> like the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my
    >> HTML like a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening
    >> tag, or a tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character
    >> missing or in the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my HTML
    >> through the application and have the program fix tag typos for me. Are
    >> there any programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut it, cuz it
    >> does not find errors for me.

    >
    > http://validator.w3.org/


    Ok I can upload files to this thing. But a program might be simpler. Do
    Coffee Cup and Hot Dog Pro do this?
     
    Bob, Apr 22, 2006
    #7
  8. Bob

    Bob Guest

    Jonathan N. Little wrote:
    > Hywel Jenkins wrote:
    >> Bob wrote:
    >>> What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something
    >>> like the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my
    >>> HTML like a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening
    >>> tag, or a tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character
    >>> missing or in the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my
    >>> HTML through the application and have the program fix tag typos for
    >>> me. Are there any programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut
    >>> it, cuz it does not find errors for me.

    >>
    >> http://validator.w3.org/
    >>

    >
    > You could also use a text editor with syntax highlighting which can help
    > you quickly identify typos, I personally like freeware Crimson Editor
    > http://www.nullsoft.com but there are many out there


    Right, but it doesn't point them out for you. You still have to trudge
    through the code, right?
     
    Bob, Apr 22, 2006
    #8
  9. Bob

    Bob Guest

    Andy Dingley wrote:
    > On Fri, 21 Apr 2006 22:56:14 -0700, Bob <> wrote:
    >
    >> What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something like
    >> the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my HTML like
    >> a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening tag, or a
    >> tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character missing or in
    >> the wrong place).

    >
    > There aren't many of these, because it's a non -trivial problem to parse
    > properly. Some of the older ones aren't all that accurate. Many of them
    > today parse XML fine (which is easier) but can't do it for HTML. There
    > are still some though, if you look.


    I go through "fixing" my code, deleting old bad links and stuff, and I
    end up with </a> tags stranded, and other stupid errors. I'm using
    Blogger but I usually work in Blogger's HTML editor because it's Compose
    window is so buggy. If there is even one screwed up tag, Blogger refuses
    to upload the post. But it doesn't bother to point out where the
    erroneous tag is.

    Blogger's Composer is really bad. It throws in weird <font> tags with no
    closing tag, sometimes 1000's of them. One time it put 100's of <wendy>
    tags because the post was a conversation with "Wendy". It also does
    stuff like taking every word in a given paragraph and making an anchor
    tag out of it, really weird. It's just insane. Plus if you fix &'s with
    &amp; Blogger goes through and reverts all the &amp; back to & if you
    open the Compose window again.

    Not only that, but it puts in an unholy amount of excess tags,
    especially if you start cutting and pasting stuff.
    >
    > You'd do well do get a copy of HTML Kit for starters, because that
    > includes HTML Tidy.


    Ok, this runs on my drive like a program?
    >
    > For issues about appropriate nesting of elements, rather than merey
    > syntactic well-formedness, then look for a real validator, like the W3C
    > one.


    Yes. I usually use Tidy for that, once the page is uploaded.
     
    Bob, Apr 22, 2006
    #9
  10. Bob

    David Segall Guest

    Bob <> wrote:

    >Hywel Jenkins wrote:
    >> Bob wrote:
    >>> What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something
    >>> like the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my
    >>> HTML like a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening
    >>> tag, or a tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character
    >>> missing or in the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my HTML
    >>> through the application and have the program fix tag typos for me. Are
    >>> there any programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut it, cuz it
    >>> does not find errors for me.

    >>
    >> http://validator.w3.org/

    >
    >I want something that fixes local tags, not online tags. I want an
    >application that runs on my hard drive so I can check plain text
    >documents. I already have the Tidy extension for Firefox but that only
    >works on webpages, not text files on my drive.

    Macromedia (now Adobe) Dreamweaver
    <http://www.macromedia.com/software/dreamweaver/> has a 30 day free
    trial. You may not find it worth the purchase price if you only want
    to use the inbuilt validator.

    The open source Nvu <http://www.nvu.com/index.html> will submit the
    page you are editing, regardless of location, to
    <http://validator.w3.org/>.
     
    David Segall, Apr 22, 2006
    #10
  11. David Dorward, Apr 22, 2006
    #11
  12. Bob wrote:
    > Jonathan N. Little wrote:

    <snip>
    >> You could also use a text editor with syntax highlighting which can
    >> help you quickly identify typos, I personally like freeware Crimson
    >> Editor http://www.nullsoft.com but there are many out there

    >
    > Right, but it doesn't point them out for you. You still have to trudge
    > through the code, right?


    Well you have to have some idea of the syntax, no it won't do the work
    for you but if you have many a typo it will not be to correct color!

    --
    Take care,

    Jonathan
    -------------------
    LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
    http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com
     
    Jonathan N. Little, Apr 22, 2006
    #12
  13. Bob

    frederick Guest

    David Segall wrote:
    > The open source Nvu <http://www.nvu.com/index.html> will submit the
    > page you are editing, regardless of location, to
    > <http://validator.w3.org/>.


    I think that recommendation should be caveated, since Nvu is incapable
    of refraining from rewriting one's source code.


    In theory, any HTML editor that uses syntax highlighting should be
    useful for the OP's needs; similarly, any program that includes HTML
    Tidy as a tool.

    For CSS, TopStyle used to have a stripped-down version available for
    free. I don't believe that they do this any more, but it should be
    possible to find a copy online from one of the usual download sites.
    Although very basic, the free versions had syntax highlighting,
    code-completion, and a properties window, which all seem perfectly
    adequate for the OP's needs.

    --
    AGw.
     
    frederick, Apr 22, 2006
    #13
  14. Bob

    Bob Guest

    Jonathan N. Little wrote:
    > Bob wrote:
    >> Jonathan N. Little wrote:

    > <snip>
    >>> You could also use a text editor with syntax highlighting which can
    >>> help you quickly identify typos, I personally like freeware Crimson
    >>> Editor http://www.nullsoft.com but there are many out there

    >>
    >> Right, but it doesn't point them out for you. You still have to trudge
    >> through the code, right?

    >
    > Well you have to have some idea of the syntax, no it won't do the work
    > for you


    I am not asking for that. I make stupid mistakes like stranding closing
    tags with openers and leaving off " like <div align=center"> missing a
    ". I know how to write them correctly but I make dumb errors
    accidentally. For correcting my syntax, I will use Tidy.

    but if you have many a typo it will not be to correct color!

    Ok, so the typos are highlighted as a different color.
     
    Bob, Apr 23, 2006
    #14
  15. Bob

    Bob Guest

    frederick wrote:
    > David Segall wrote:
    >> The open source Nvu <http://www.nvu.com/index.html> will submit the
    >> page you are editing, regardless of location, to
    >> <http://validator.w3.org/>.

    >
    > I think that recommendation should be caveated, since Nvu is incapable
    > of refraining from rewriting one's source code.
    >
    >
    > In theory, any HTML editor that uses syntax highlighting should be
    > useful for the OP's needs; similarly, any program that includes HTML
    > Tidy as a tool.
    >
    > For CSS, TopStyle used to have a stripped-down version available for
    > free. I don't believe that they do this any more, but it should be
    > possible to find a copy online from one of the usual download sites.
    > Although very basic, the free versions had syntax highlighting,
    > code-completion, and a properties window, which all seem perfectly
    > adequate for the OP's needs.


    I would also like code-completion. Do Hot Dog Pro and Coffee Cup, etc.
    do that. Also having the tags off to the site where I can just click
    them to put them in instead of having to type them out all time?
     
    Bob, Apr 23, 2006
    #15
  16. Bob

    dorayme Guest

    In article <e2cgic$uhg$>, Bob <> wrote:

    > What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something like
    > the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my HTML like
    > a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening tag, or a
    > tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character missing or in
    > the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my HTML through the
    > application and have the program fix tag typos for me. Are there any
    > programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut it, cuz it does not
    > find errors for me.


    In BBedit, for a Mac, you just press a keyboard command and it
    checks the doc in no time at all and lists the errors according
    to the doctype. In free Mac editors like the old BBEdit Lite, or
    its modern equivalent, Textwrangler, you can put in plugins like
    Tidy. You are right to want a facility like this. In the Firefox
    (Mac or PC) browser there are extensions you can install that
    make this process of checking reasonable easy on line but it is
    not as direct and therefore as handy as. If you are on broadband,
    it is probably pretty good though.

    --
    dorayme
     
    dorayme, Apr 23, 2006
    #16
  17. Bob

    Mark Parnell Guest

    Deciding to do something for the good of humanity, Bob <>
    declared in alt.html:

    [HTML-Kit]
    > Ok, this runs on my drive like a program?


    It's an HTML editor. http://chami.com/html-kit/

    --
    Mark Parnell
    My Usenet is improved; yours could be too:
    http://blinkynet.net/comp/uip5.html
     
    Mark Parnell, Apr 24, 2006
    #17
  18. Bob

    Bob Guest

    Mark Parnell wrote:
    > Deciding to do something for the good of humanity, Bob <>
    > declared in alt.html:
    >
    > [HTML-Kit]
    >> Ok, this runs on my drive like a program?

    >
    > It's an HTML editor. http://chami.com/html-kit/


    Homesite does this too. It searches for broken tags, etc. It also has a
    "tag selector" which is something else I am looking for. Why would any
    web designer prefer to use a Notepad-type application and type out all
    their tags by hand instead of using writing HTML with one of these tag
    selector programs that lets you grab the tags off a menu? It would seem
    to be so much faster to use the application and just grab the tags.
    >
     
    Bob, Apr 24, 2006
    #18
  19. Bob

    Bob Guest

    dorayme wrote:
    > In article <e2cgic$uhg$>, Bob <> wrote:
    >
    >> What I am interested in is not a WYSIWYG application but something like
    >> the old Hot Dog Pro (I think). Sometimes I have mistakes in my HTML like
    >> a tag opened and not closed or a tag closed with no opening tag, or a
    >> tag that is written slightly incorrectly (one character missing or in
    >> the wrong place). I would like to be able to run my HTML through the
    >> application and have the program fix tag typos for me. Are there any
    >> programs like that out there. Notepad++ don't cut it, cuz it does not
    >> find errors for me.

    >
    > In BBedit, for a Mac, you just press a keyboard command and it
    > checks the doc in no time at all and lists the errors according
    > to the doctype. In free Mac editors like the old BBEdit Lite, or
    > its modern equivalent, Textwrangler, you can put in plugins like
    > Tidy. You are right to want a facility like this. In the Firefox
    > (Mac or PC) browser there are extensions you can install that
    > make this process of checking reasonable easy on line but it is
    > not as direct and therefore as handy as. If you are on broadband,
    > it is probably pretty good though.


    It works fine, but it's not that easy to check a local file. I guess I
    could just rename it .html and then load it up in FF and have it run
    Tidy on it, but it seems like a hassle.

    I just figured out that Homesite and Dreamweaver also have something
    like this.

    Tidy works pretty good on broadband, but there are some scripts that the
    prog uses to run and sometimes the script clogs up FF and its hard to
    run Tidy on the page. Plus the extension really dislikes pages with tons
    of errors on them, like say over 1,000 errors, esp 20,000 errors or so.
    Those pages almost choke the extension.

    In addition, for a novice HTML user like myself, the descriptions of the
    errors are not always easy to understand. After you use it for a while
    and learn more HTML and esp how to interpret the often-obtuse error
    messages, you can use it a lot better. Plus, sometimes when Tidy "cleans
    up" the HTML, the "cleaned version" of the page is somewhat broken,
    visually-wise, so then I just leave the "errors" in.

    All in all, it's one of the coolest FF extensions out there.
     
    Bob, Apr 24, 2006
    #19
  20. In article <e2hkk1$706$>, Bob <> wrote:

    > Why would any
    > web designer prefer to use a Notepad-type application and type out all
    > their tags by hand instead of using writing HTML with one of these tag
    > selector programs that lets you grab the tags off a menu? It would seem
    > to be so much faster to use the application and just grab the tags.


    I know nothing of Notepad, but it's faster for me to type *any* element
    in a text editor than it is to select it by menu. I use a program that
    costs quite a bit and I generally ignore that feature.
    You need to become comfortable with typing <, >, and /. On my keyboard,
    they're all together. Then HTML markup becomes lightning quick.
    Struggle with CSS issues when your semantics are correct.

    leo

    --
    <http://web0.greatbasin.net/~leo/>
     
    Leonard Blaisdell, Apr 24, 2006
    #20
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