underlining <sup>

Discussion in 'HTML' started by bernhard, Nov 2, 2005.

  1. bernhard

    bernhard Guest

    Hey,

    I try to to underline a <h4> header, which contains also superscripted
    text:
    <h4>product-name<sup>&reg;</sup></h4>
    with this css:
    h4 { text-decoration: underline; }

    This works fine in Firefox, but in IE and Opera, the text decoration
    gets
    also superscripted, which looks very odd. For a better appearance, I
    tried
    to switch off underlining for the superscripted portion and added to
    the css
    h4 sup { text-decoration: none; }

    This does not help, the superscripted portion appears still underlined
    in
    all 3 browsers.

    Any idea?

    Thx 4 ur help, Bernhard
     
    bernhard, Nov 2, 2005
    #1
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  2. bernhard

    Toby Inkster Guest

    bernhard wrote:

    > <h4>product-name<sup>&reg;</sup></h4>


    This doesn't answer your question, but traditionally the registered
    trademark symbol is used placed on the baseline with other text: not
    superscripted. Ditto the copyright symbol.

    --
    Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
    Contact Me ~ http://tobyinkster.co.uk/contact
     
    Toby Inkster, Nov 2, 2005
    #2
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  3. Also sprach bernhard:

    > <h4>product-name<sup>&reg;</sup></h4>
    > h4 { text-decoration: underline; }
    > This works fine in Firefox, but in IE and Opera, the text decoration gets
    > also superscripted, which looks very odd.
    > Any idea?


    Instead of underlining, you could set a border-bottom for h1. Then, however,
    the "underline" would stretch over the full width.
     
    Thomas Mlynarczyk, Nov 2, 2005
    #3
  4. bernhard

    Neredbojias Guest

    With neither quill nor qualm, bernhard quothed:

    > Hey,
    >
    > I try to to underline a <h4> header, which contains also superscripted
    > text:
    > <h4>product-name<sup>&reg;</sup></h4>
    > with this css:
    > h4 { text-decoration: underline; }
    >
    > This works fine in Firefox, but in IE and Opera, the text decoration
    > gets
    > also superscripted, which looks very odd. For a better appearance, I
    > tried
    > to switch off underlining for the superscripted portion and added to
    > the css
    > h4 sup { text-decoration: none; }
    >
    > This does not help, the superscripted portion appears still underlined
    > in
    > all 3 browsers.
    >
    > Any idea?


    Instead of <sup>, span the &reg; and use line-height and vertical-align
    with font-size-adjust. (Untried regarding underline, though.)

    --
    Neredbojias
    Contrary to popular belief, it is believable.
     
    Neredbojias, Nov 2, 2005
    #4
  5. bernhard

    bernhard Guest

    I tried that before, this obviously has the same visual effect as
    <sup>, and also moves the underline to the new baseline
    ("superscripted").
    I also like a clean markup, <span> controls appearance only, where
    <sub> and <sup> have a semantic meaning.
     
    bernhard, Nov 2, 2005
    #5
  6. bernhard

    bernhard Guest

    You're right with &copy;
    But I disgree with &reg; and &tm; I think I have never seen those two
    unsuperscripted. Maybe there are different rules depending on region /
    country?
     
    bernhard, Nov 2, 2005
    #6
  7. bernhard

    Neredbojias Guest

    With neither quill nor qualm, bernhard quothed:

    > I tried that before, this obviously has the same visual effect as
    > <sup>, and also moves the underline to the new baseline
    > ("superscripted").


    I see, although I was under the impression that a superscript baseline
    was the same as its normal (parent) baseline.

    > I also like a clean markup, <span> controls appearance only, where
    > <sub> and <sup> have a semantic meaning.


    True.

    --
    Neredbojias
    Contrary to popular belief, it is believable.
     
    Neredbojias, Nov 3, 2005
    #7
  8. bernhard

    kchayka Guest

    Neredbojias wrote:
    >
    > Instead of <sup>, span the &reg; and use line-height and vertical-align
    > with font-size-adjust.


    Which browsers support font-size-adjust? IIRC, it was dropped from the
    CSS 2.1 spec due to lack of support.

    --
    Reply email address is a bottomless spam bucket.
    Please reply to the group so everyone can share.
     
    kchayka, Nov 3, 2005
    #8
  9. bernhard

    Neredbojias Guest

    With neither quill nor qualm, kchayka quothed:

    > Neredbojias wrote:
    > >
    > > Instead of <sup>, span the &reg; and use line-height and vertical-align
    > > with font-size-adjust.

    >
    > Which browsers support font-size-adjust? IIRC, it was dropped from the
    > CSS 2.1 spec due to lack of support.


    Interesting. I could think of other things about w3c css/html specs
    they could at least change for the better, too.

    --
    Neredbojias
    Contrary to popular belief, it is believable.
     
    Neredbojias, Nov 4, 2005
    #9
  10. "Neredbojias" <> skrev i meddelandet
    news:...
    > With neither quill nor qualm, kchayka quothed:
    >
    > > Neredbojias wrote:
    > > >
    > > > Instead of <sup>, span the &reg; and use line-height and

    vertical-align
    > > > with font-size-adjust.

    > >
    > > Which browsers support font-size-adjust? IIRC, it was dropped from the
    > > CSS 2.1 spec due to lack of support.

    >
    > Interesting. I could think of other things about w3c css/html specs
    > they could at least change for the better, too.



    For example?


    --
    Write in peace for peace
    Luigi Donatello Asero
    [it], [de], [en], [sv], [...]
     
    Luigi Donatello Asero, Nov 4, 2005
    #10
  11. bernhard

    brucie Guest

    In post <news:4qyaf.37500$>,
    Luigi Donatello Asero said:

    >> I could think of other things about w3c css/html specs
    >> they could at least change for the better, too.


    > For example?


    i've been saying it since '96! more gratuitous violence and nudity


    --
    l i t t l e v o i c e s
     
    brucie, Nov 4, 2005
    #11
  12. bernhard

    Mark Parnell Guest

    In our last episode, brucie <> pronounced to
    alt.html:

    > nudity


    There's plenty of that now that you're back with your X-Face.

    --
    Mark Parnell
    http://clarkecomputers.com.au
     
    Mark Parnell, Nov 4, 2005
    #12
  13. bernhard

    Neredbojias Guest

    With neither quill nor qualm, Luigi Donatello Asero quothed:

    >
    > "Neredbojias" <> skrev i meddelandet
    > news:...
    > > With neither quill nor qualm, kchayka quothed:
    > >
    > > > Neredbojias wrote:
    > > > >
    > > > > Instead of <sup>, span the &reg; and use line-height and

    > vertical-align
    > > > > with font-size-adjust.
    > > >
    > > > Which browsers support font-size-adjust? IIRC, it was dropped from the
    > > > CSS 2.1 spec due to lack of support.

    > >
    > > Interesting. I could think of other things about w3c css/html specs
    > > they could at least change for the better, too.

    >
    >
    > For example?


    No, it would be like arguing politics. Generally speaking, css is
    mediocre and its implementation is mediocre on any browser to date,
    which is in part due to its mediocre nature in the first place.

    May times I've written a bit of css which renders differently in each of
    the 3 major browsers even though all of the renderings may be
    technically correct. Floats are a beauty, but that's just one thing
    among many. The css model is poor and ambiguous, that's the real
    problem.

    --
    Neredbojias
    Contrary to popular belief, it is believable.
     
    Neredbojias, Nov 4, 2005
    #13
  14. "bernhard" <> wrote:

    > You're right with &copy;
    > But I disgree with &reg; and &tm; I think I have never seen those two
    > unsuperscripted. Maybe there are different rules depending on region /
    > country?


    They all appear in different shapes in different fonts. The registered sign
    is particularly varying: sometimes a full-size "R" inside a circle, sometimes
    a tiny little superscripted "R" in a circle.

    Therefore, it should not be put inside <sup> markup. You might get extra
    extra extra tiny symbol.

    Simply use &reg; and leave it that, or leave the &reg; out. You probably
    don't really need to use it in the first place, and you don't need to use it
    in a _heading_ even if you need to mention once that that Foo is a registered
    trademark of Bar.

    --
    Yucca, http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/
    Pages about Web authoring: http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/www.html
     
    Jukka K. Korpela, Nov 4, 2005
    #14
  15. "Neredbojias" <> skrev i meddelandet
    news:...
    > With neither quill nor qualm, Luigi Donatello Asero quothed:
    >
    > >
    > > "Neredbojias" <> skrev i meddelandet
    > > news:...
    > > > With neither quill nor qualm, kchayka quothed:
    > > >
    > > > > Neredbojias wrote:
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Instead of <sup>, span the &reg; and use line-height and

    > > vertical-align
    > > > > > with font-size-adjust.
    > > > >
    > > > > Which browsers support font-size-adjust? IIRC, it was dropped from

    the
    > > > > CSS 2.1 spec due to lack of support.
    > > >
    > > > Interesting. I could think of other things about w3c css/html specs
    > > > they could at least change for the better, too.

    > >
    > >
    > > For example?

    >
    > No, it would be like arguing politics. Generally speaking, css is
    > mediocre and its implementation is mediocre on any browser to date,
    > which is in part due to its mediocre nature in the first place.
    >
    > May times I've written a bit of css which renders differently in each of
    > the 3 major browsers even though all of the renderings may be
    > technically correct. Floats are a beauty, but that's just one thing
    > among many. The css model is poor and ambiguous, that's the real
    > problem.


    You may be right.


    --
    Write in peace for peace
    Luigi Donatello Asero
    [it], [de], [en], [sv], [...]
     
    Luigi Donatello Asero, Nov 4, 2005
    #15
  16. bernhard

    Toby Inkster Guest

    kchayka wrote:

    > Which browsers support font-size-adjust?


    None of which I know.

    --
    Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
    Contact Me ~ http://tobyinkster.co.uk/contact
     
    Toby Inkster, Nov 5, 2005
    #16
  17. bernhard

    Toby Inkster Guest

    bernhard wrote:

    > You're right with &copy;
    > But I disgree with &reg; and &tm; I think I have never seen those two
    > unsuperscripted.


    For &reg;...

    See the first paragraph under "Intellectual Property Licensing Policy
    (Revised December 2003)" here:
    http://www.microsoft.com/mscorp/ip/

    First paragraph under "About the Netscape Network" here:
    http://channels.netscape.com/info/tos.jsp

    Very last paragraph here:
    http://www.fox.com/corporate/terms.htm

    Also:
    http://www.whitepages.com.au/wp/legal/trademarks.html
    http://www.unix.org/trademark.html (1st item on menu bar)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trademark (search page for "Photoshop")
    http://www.rbc.com/legal/trademark.html
    http://www.apple.com/legal/trademark/appletmlist.html
    http://www.chevrolet.com/copyright/ (search page for "NASCAR")
    http://www.linuxmark.org/

    For &trade;, you don't need to superscript, as most fonts automatically
    raise the â„¢ sign off the baseline.

    --
    Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
    Contact Me ~ http://tobyinkster.co.uk/contact
     
    Toby Inkster, Nov 5, 2005
    #17
  18. On Sat, 5 Nov 2005, Toby Inkster wrote:

    > kchayka wrote:
    >
    > > Which browsers support font-size-adjust?

    >
    > None of which I know.


    I've seen something in Amaya. None of the "popular" browsers, anyway.

    I don't think it does any harm on browsers that don't implement it,
    but I wouldn't see any real point in using it in a general web page at
    the moment.

    A pity: implementing it could go a long way towards resolving the
    notorious issues caused when an author specifies Verdana font.
     
    Alan J. Flavell, Nov 5, 2005
    #18
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