Awesome flash site... can swing do this?

S

Sudsy

keith said:
Hello,

Check out the below flash application... Is there anything comparable
URL using applets/swing out there?

https://reservations.ihotelier.com/onescreen.cfm?hotelid=2867

Keith

I wouldn't know...just a puzzle piece shows up in my browser window.
Hmmm...could be that I eschew proprietary formats, preferring to
stick with published and established protocols like HTML/HTTP.
Oh wait! Macromedia doesn't support my browser/OS combination in
any case.
There's certainly a case to be made for portability...
 
A

Andrew Thompson

keith edward wrote: ... ...
I wouldn't know... ...
There's certainly a case to be made for portability...

I was about to comment on first seeing this, that since
flash is not installed on my Win/IE box, 'not on PC's
with no Flash installed'.

And ask.. what is 'it'?

--
Andrew Thompson
http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology
http://www.lensescapes.com/ Images that escape the mundane
 
R

Rogue Chameleon

Stay away from flash for building your entire site..... you never know who
doesn't have it setup on their browser.
 
C

Chris Uppal

Andrew said:
I was about to comment on first seeing this, that since
flash is not installed on my Win/IE box, 'not on PC's
with no Flash installed'.

I think it'd be pretty easy to write an applet[*] that displayed the message
"Click here to download plugin", which is how it appears on my machine too ;-)

WInXPro + FireFox, so not /that/ unusual.

([*] though I wouldn't want to understate the difficulties of /deploying/ it,
once written ;-)

-- chris
 
A

Andrew Thompson

Stay away from flash for building your entire site.....

Sensible advice, but..
... you never know who
doesn't have it setup on their browser.

...you could also replace 'Flash' with 'Java' or 'Javascript', or...

A site should be navigable and minimally functional with pure HTML.

--
Andrew Thompson
http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology
http://www.lensescapes.com/ Images that escape the mundane
 
A

Andrew Thompson

I think it'd be pretty easy to write an applet[*] .. ...
([*] though I wouldn't want to understate the difficulties of /deploying/ it,
once written ;-)

LOL! I wish I'd never had to encounter half those
difficulties, let alone had to solve them myself..

I could have achieved so much more by now if I had not become
obsessed with making UA deployment of Java (anywhere near) reliable.

And I am still wonderring what this site actually does,
since none of the people who have flash have described
the UI (scrolling text links, 3D VR walk-throughs, ...),
nor posted a screenshot.

To the OP, it is very handy to provide an URL as you did,
but a little textual description would not go astray, for
those of us using screen-readers, in any case. ;-)

So.. ??

--
Andrew Thompson
http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology
http://www.lensescapes.com/ Images that escape the mundane
 
J

Joe Smith

I think it'd be pretty easy to write an applet[*] .. ..
([*] though I wouldn't want to understate the difficulties of /deploying/ it,
once written ;-)

To the OP, it is very handy to provide an URL as you did,
but a little textual description would not go astray, for
those of us using screen-readers, in any case. ;-)

Ok, guys... I happen to have Flash, and the site is not THAT great. I don't
like either the idea of developing in a propietary language/format, but I
believe the web, given the adoption of broadband connections, should evolve
to richer interfaces. The statistic-ness of the PURE html (no javascript/no
java/no nothing) seems ... old. Do you think that SVG is up to that task?
 
K

kaeli

Ok, guys... I happen to have Flash, and the site is not THAT great. I don't
like either the idea of developing in a propietary language/format, but I
believe the web, given the adoption of broadband connections, should evolve
to richer interfaces. The statistic-ness of the PURE html (no javascript/no
java/no nothing) seems ... old. Do you think that SVG is up to that task?

I, for one, prefer Flash to applets.

*cringes*

Applets never run well on my machine at home (they hesitate, for lack of a
better description). It runs better in IE than Firefox, but I don't like IE.
I don't know why. At this point, I don't care. I just turned off the darn
things.
I like Flash, though. It runs the same no matter which browser I'm using.

This is from a user with Windows and Firefox who just sees applets and Flash
for stupid web games, so don't shoot me, mmkay? ;)

Oh, and FWIW, I heard using Swing for applets was a bad idea b/c many
browsers don't support it yet. Is that still true?

--
--
~kaeli~
To steal ideas from one person is plagiarism; to steal from
many is research.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace
 
M

Michael Borgwardt

kaeli said:
Oh, and FWIW, I heard using Swing for applets was a bad idea b/c many
browsers don't support it yet. Is that still true?

The browsers support it just fine, it just doesn't come preinstalled with Windows.
 
C

Chris Uppal

kaeli said:
I, for one, prefer Flash to applets.

*cringes*

<grin>

Oh I have nothing much against Flash myself -- in fact it's quite a nice
technology, IMO, albeit overused -- but it's not on my machine by default, and
I don't know of any benefits it brings (to me, personally) that make up for the
effort of installing it, and the minor, but not zero, increased risk of
trusting more third party code.

besides, not having it installed in my browser gives me yet another reason to
chunter irritably about website designers, and What the World is Coming to
These Days...

-- chris
 
T

Tim Jowers

Ann said:
I didn't see anything that could not be done with java swing, was
there something in particular that you wonder about?

Yes but why pay you to make a flash site with Java? Heck, some people
are disabling Java in their browsers as the 'softies recommend this as
a way to reduce viruses! I have flash here and work but just skip
sites that require it when I'm at home. I already have a TV and don't
need the web to entertain me/kill my time.

You can surely get a good flash programmer for that cheaper than an
expert Swing/GUI programmer which would be needed but the time to
market would be about the same. In the end, though, I'd still prefer
HTML and JavaScript as it has a much greater chance of working on most
browsers. I.e. you can even do that whole page in HTML and JavaScript.

Well, maybe soon Java will have a greater chance of working than
JavaScript due to the growth of alternative web browsers, Mac, and
Linux. Hmmm... interesting idea.

TimJowers
 
B

Bryce

Stay away from flash for building your entire site..... you never know who
doesn't have it setup on their browser.

And stay away from using images in your HTML sites too. The user may
be browsing using Lynx.

Seriously though, you need to look at your audience. If you don't care
if the user doesn't have Flash then fine. I had a guy who wanted me to
do his website. He wanted all the Flash stuff. I said fine, but also
recommended that we have a non-Flash site as well, just in case (bonus
benefit is that I can charge him more for doing two sites).

Flash and Java Applets provide a great way to deploy rich internet
applications. Sometimes, you can just accept that some won't have that
setup on their browsers, and accept that they won't visit your site. I
for one, don't mind Flash. You can do some cool stuff with it, and not
just pretty animations.

But.. To answer the OP question. You can do that with Java. Java
doesn't provide the same kind of controls that Flash does. Flash was
built around movies, so it is characterized by "cartoony" looking UI
elements and animated actions (such as sliding panels, etc).

To each his/her own, and YMMV.
 
G

Grant Wagner

Rogue said:
Agreed.... javascript is also evil.

His comment does not say that. It says that a site should be navigable
and minimally functional with pure HTML.

This means that JavaScript (Java, Flash) can be used to enhance, but not
replace, static content.

User agents with JavaScript (Java, Flash) unavailable or disabled should
get a (minimally) functional site.

User agents with JavaScript (Java, Flash) available and enabled can
receive a much richer experience.

This means that it's best to let the browser render all relevant content
initially, then hide/manipulate content using JavaScript after the page
has finished loading. This means that:

<body onload="hide();">
<script type="text/javascript">
function hide() {
if (document.getElementById) {
var d = document.getElementById('submenu');
if (d && d.style && typeof d.style == 'string') {
d.style.display = 'none';
}
}
}
</script>
<div id="menu"><!-- menu --></div>
<div id="submenu"><!-- submenu --></div>

is preferable to:

<div id="menu"><!-- menu --></div>
<div id="submenu" style="display:none;"><!-- submenu --></div>

The first example hides the submenu only after it has been determined
that the browser has the ability to hide the content (which implies, but
does guarantee, that it can make it visible again).

The second example hides the submenu in all browsers which understand
style="display:none;", which includes many browsers which have _no_ means
to undo the application of that style at a later time.
 
A

Andrew Thompson

His comment does not say that. It says that a site should be navigable
and minimally functional with pure HTML.

In fact, I'll go further. If as effect can be done in JS,
Java of Flash, Javascript would generally be the best
way to go.

Script may take sligthtly longer to load than the equivalent
Java or Flash, but you can rely on..
1) Higher overall market penetration*
2) Quicker 'start-up' than the JVM, though I am not sure about Shockwave.
3) A UI (written in HTML) that adjusts more easily to the
user's preferences.

* Note that even if JS did not have higher usage than either
Flash or Java, you need to also think of the Java/Flash implementations
that are effectively reliant on Javascript, a prominent example is
the output of HTMLConverter if the deployer selects 'all browsers/
all platforms'.

--
Andrew Thompson
http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology
http://www.lensescapes.com/ Images that escape the mundane
 
L

LX-i

Chris said:
Andrew said:
]
I wouldn't know...
..

There's certainly a case to be made for portability...

I was about to comment on first seeing this, that since
flash is not installed on my Win/IE box, 'not on PC's
with no Flash installed'.

I think it'd be pretty easy to write an applet[*] that displayed the message
"Click here to download plugin", which is how it appears on my machine too ;-)

heh - that's be a good joke site. And, have the link for the plugin to
download have a random set of plugin links, like Shockwave, Java,
RealPlayer, etc. ;) Use cookies, and see how many times they come back
and try it.


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