JavaFX: dead on start?

Discussion in 'Java' started by soup_or_power@yahoo.com, Jan 21, 2009.

  1. Guest

    Hi

    I was reading the slide presentation of Java FX at this URL

    http://www.javapassion.com/javafx/javafx_overview.pdf

    Towards the end the slide says this about deployment:

    • JavaFX 1.0 applications can be deployed using the two
    standard Java deployment technologies
    > Java Plugin: A tool used for deploying Java applets that run inside

    a web browser
    > Java Web Start: A tool used for deploying stand-alone Java

    applications on the desktop, using JNLP (Java Network Launching
    Protocol).
    • Or using mobile emulation
    > JavaFX 1.0 Mobile Emulator Beta Release: A tool provided with

    the JavaFX 1.0 SDK, which displays your applications as they
    would look on a typical mobile device.

    Is anyone using applets these days? And the Java Web Start is
    practically moot.
    Why would anyone run a thick app on the desktop?

    Thanks
    , Jan 21, 2009
    #1
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  2. Arne Vajhøj Guest

    wrote:
    > Is anyone using applets these days?


    Not many.

    > Why would anyone run a thick app on the desktop?


    Better functionality and better look and feel.

    RIA is reasonably hot today: Adobe Flex, JavaFX,
    MS Silverlight and super-heavy AJAX.

    Arne
    Arne Vajhøj, Jan 22, 2009
    #2
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  3. <> wrote in message
    news:...
    [ SNIP ]
    Why would anyone run a thick app on the desktop?

    Thanks
    ****************************************
    Take a look at a typical web page these days...those _are_ thick
    applications. Even leaving aside Java FX, Silverlight, Flex etc, just with
    JavaScript and CSS (and yes, the CSS is being used in such a way that it
    contributes to the logic) web pages can contain a lot of the code and be
    quite heavyweight.

    Why would people design their apps that way? Well, if the data in question
    is not rapidly changing, and all (or most) of the user interactions can be
    handled by the client, why not have the client do the computing? Most
    people's computers are sadly underutilized by almost everything they
    do...servers OTOH can be struggling.

    AHS
    Arved Sandstrom, Jan 22, 2009
    #3
  4. Qu0ll Guest

    <> wrote in message
    news:...

    [...]

    > Is anyone using applets these days?


    Yes, plenty of people, me included. The advances in Java 6 Update 10 (the
    so-called "consumer" release of the JRE) including much faster startup times
    and better browser integration have made applets a very rich and viable
    platform. They did this primarily to support the then soon-to-be-released
    JavaFX which is also rich and viable. Long live applets!

    > And the Java Web Start is practically moot.


    What makes you say this? Java Web Start is an awesome technology that
    allows you to launch desktop applications right from within your browser.
    It is widely used and exceedingly useful.

    > Why would anyone run a thick app on the desktop?


    Where else would you run it? Let's face it, many desktops are more powerful
    than some servers so why wouldn't you want to take advantage of all that
    processing power? Who can be satisfied with boring, dull server-based web
    technologies? We all want rich apps these days.

    --
    And loving it,

    -Qu0ll (Rare, not extinct)
    _________________________________________________

    [Replace the "SixFour" with numbers to email me]
    Qu0ll, Jan 22, 2009
    #4
  5. blue indigo Guest

    On Thu, 5623 Sep 1993 01:36:39 +0000, Steve Sobol wrote:

    > On 2009-01-22, =?windows-1252?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <> wrote:
    >
    >> RIA is reasonably hot today: Adobe Flex, JavaFX,
    >> MS Silverlight and super-heavy AJAX.

    >
    > Flex and JavaFX look interesting.


    Seconded.

    --
    blue indigo
    UA Telecom since 1987
    blue indigo, Jan 23, 2009
    #5
  6. Arne Vajhøj Guest

    Qu0ll wrote:
    > <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Is anyone using applets these days?

    >
    > Yes, plenty of people, me included.


    If you look at web sites around, then applets are
    not that common.

    >> And the Java Web Start is practically moot.


    > It is widely used and exceedingly useful.


    It may be very useful. But since Java client apps are
    not that popular (compared to alternative client technologies
    or server side Java), then also that usage is somewhat
    limited.

    If I were to guess then I would say that about 0.5% of
    Java developers work with Java applets and/or Java Web Start.
    But if we assume 2 million Java developers then that is still
    10000 Java developers.

    Arne
    Arne Vajhøj, Jan 23, 2009
    #6
  7. Arne Vajhøj Guest

    Steve Sobol wrote:
    > On 2009-01-22, =?windows-1252?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <> wrote:
    >> RIA is reasonably hot today: Adobe Flex, JavaFX,
    >> MS Silverlight and super-heavy AJAX.

    >
    > Flex and JavaFX look interesting. Flex, in particular, allows me to build
    > apps with Flash or HTML/AJAX and doesn't require me to learn a whole new
    > language. (JavaFX looks very different from Java)


    If you happen to already know AS then that argument is valid.

    One advantage with JavaFX is that even though it is a
    different language, then you can use existing
    Java libs from it.

    Arne
    Arne Vajhøj, Jan 25, 2009
    #7
  8. Roedy Green Guest

    On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 09:15:33 -0800 (PST), ""
    <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone
    who said :

    >
    >Is anyone using applets these days? And the Java Web Start is
    >practically moot.
    >Why would anyone run a thick app on the desktop?


    I run Applets. MS has tried to kill them, but there are so many
    browsers it cannot succeed now.

    JWS is a wonderful technology. The browser is optional. It handles
    updates. It does one click installs. It lets you include native code
    and have the correct platform automatically included.

    What baffles me is why grown people are jerking around with toy
    languages like Ajax and JavaScript.
    --
    Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
    http://mindprod.com

    "Here is a point of no return after which warming becomes unstoppable
    and we are probably going to sail right through it.
    It is the point at which anthropogenic (human-caused) warming triggers
    huge releases of carbon dioxide from warming oceans, or similar releases
    of both carbon dioxide and methane from melting permafrost, or both.
    Most climate scientists think that point lies not far beyond 2°C (4°F) C hotter."
    ~ Gwynne Dyer
    Roedy Green, Jan 25, 2009
    #8
  9. Guest

    On Jan 22, 1:36 am, Steve Sobol <> wrote:
    > On 2009-01-22, =?windows-1252?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <> wrote:
    >
    > > RIA is reasonably hot today: Adobe Flex, JavaFX,
    > > MS Silverlight and super-heavy AJAX.

    >
    > Flex and JavaFX look interesting. Flex, in particular, allows me to build
    > apps with Flash or HTML/AJAX and doesn't require me to learn a whole new
    > language. (JavaFX looks very different from Java)


    I agree, but Flash and/or AJAX may be quite alien to some Java
    programmers.

    I think we could mention that Google's GWT allows to build
    AJAX app using only Java, which may interest some
    comp.lang.java.programmers ;)

    Some of the biggest webapp are powered by GWT, like GMail and
    its 50 million+ subscribers and Google Documents.

    So GWT is pretty much a tested and proven technology (and
    it's all free and open source).

    Integration of GWT with IntelliJ IDEA 8 is very nice too
    (and with Eclipse probably too).
    , Jan 26, 2009
    #9
  10. On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 13:34:16 -0800, Roedy Green wrote:

    > On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 09:15:33 -0800 (PST), ""
    > <> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
    > said :
    >
    >
    >>Is anyone using applets these days? And the Java Web Start is
    >>practically moot.
    >>Why would anyone run a thick app on the desktop?

    >
    > I run Applets. MS has tried to kill them, but there are so many browsers
    > it cannot succeed now.
    >
    > JWS is a wonderful technology. The browser is optional. It handles
    > updates. It does one click installs. It lets you include native code and
    > have the correct platform automatically included.
    >
    > What baffles me is why grown people are jerking around with toy
    > languages like Ajax and JavaScript.


    Ah, Roedy, you know better...AJAX isn't a language. Making use of the
    XmlHttpRequest object is what it boils down to; don't even have to use
    JavaScript or XML.

    As for JavaScript being a toy language, why do you think that?

    AHS
    Arved Sandstrom, Jan 27, 2009
    #10
  11. Wojtek Guest

    Arved Sandstrom wrote :
    > On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 13:34:16 -0800, Roedy Green wrote:
    >
    > Making use of the
    > XmlHttpRequest object is what it boils down to; don't even have to use
    > JavaScript or XML.


    Well, you kind of need Javascript to use XMLHttpRequest. Not much, but
    it does need to be there.

    --
    Wojtek :)
    Wojtek, Jan 27, 2009
    #11
  12. Arne Vajhøj Guest

    Wojtek wrote:
    > Arved Sandstrom wrote :
    >> On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 13:34:16 -0800, Roedy Green wrote:
    >>
    >> Making use of the XmlHttpRequest object is what it boils down to;
    >> don't even have to use JavaScript or XML.

    >
    > Well, you kind of need Javascript to use XMLHttpRequest. Not much, but
    > it does need to be there.


    In practices: yes.

    In theory you could use IE and client side VBScript.

    Arne
    Arne Vajhøj, Jan 28, 2009
    #12
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