SOS : 4-bit binary divider circuit PLEASE!!!!!!!

Discussion in 'VHDL' started by kpk, Dec 31, 2003.

  1. kpk

    kpk Guest

    Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    am late.
    I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.

    PLEASE HELP !!!!!!!!!

    Thanks a lot
    kpk, Dec 31, 2003
    #1
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  2. (kpk) wrote in message news:<>...
    > Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    > ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    > am late.
    > I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.
    >
    > PLEASE HELP !!!!!!!!!
    >
    > Thanks a lot


    Sorry,

    I don't mind helping someone with homework if they have made a effort
    and are stuck. I draw the line when the student submits nothing to
    show that he/she has even tried to do the work. The purpose of school
    is not to turn in someone else's work--what do you learn from that? I
    also have to question the utility of assigning such a problem. I
    think the professor is out of touch with reality or is a sadist.
    Also, without considerable research, I cannot design such a counter
    using only NAND gates--not that I would want to.

    Charles
    Charles M. Elias, Dec 31, 2003
    #2
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  3. kpk

    Jim Thompson Guest

    On 31 Dec 2003 09:24:02 -0800, (Charles M.
    Elias) wrote:

    > (kpk) wrote in message news:<>...
    >> Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    >> ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    >> am late.
    >> I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.
    >>
    >> PLEASE HELP !!!!!!!!!
    >>
    >> Thanks a lot

    >
    >Sorry,
    >
    >I don't mind helping someone with homework if they have made a effort
    >and are stuck. I draw the line when the student submits nothing to
    >show that he/she has even tried to do the work. The purpose of school
    >is not to turn in someone else's work--what do you learn from that? I
    >also have to question the utility of assigning such a problem. I
    >think the professor is out of touch with reality or is a sadist.
    >Also, without considerable research, I cannot design such a counter
    >using only NAND gates--not that I would want to.
    >
    >Charles


    You can't? Sheeeesh! I'm an analog designer and I can. Ever heard
    of master-slave. Takes 9 2-in-nands (one used as an inverter) to make
    a D-flop.

    ...Jim Thompson
    --
    | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
    | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
    | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
    | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | |
    | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
    | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

    I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.
    Jim Thompson, Dec 31, 2003
    #3
  4. kpk

    Peter Alfke Guest

    If your homework is too tough,
    and the time just flies away,
    thinking hard is not enough,
    click: comp.arch.fpga.

    There you find those friendly souls,
    Austin, Philip, Peter, Ray
    filling in your knowledge holes,
    making problems go away.

    But learning is for you to do,
    even if it hurts the brain.
    The one that has to learn is you.
    There is no substitute for pain.

    If you want to learn design
    don't treat homework just as play.
    Real life is not benign,
    and you'll have to earn your pay!

    sooner or later...

    Peter Alfke
    (originally posted a few months ago, but bears repeating.)



    kpk wrote:

    > Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    > ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    > am late.
    > I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.
    >
    > PLEASE HELP !!!!!!!!!
    >
    > Thanks a lot
    Peter Alfke, Dec 31, 2003
    #4
  5. kpk

    Peter Alfke Guest

    More constructively,
    your professor wants you to:
    1. realize that you need four cascaded flip-flops,
    2. then "re-invent" the master/slave flip-flop,
    which you can also find in old TTL databooks (7474).

    Maybe an interesting learning experience,
    kind of like the boy-scout test of starting a fire without matches...
    Have fun !

    Peter Alfke
    ==============================
    Peter Alfke wrote:

    > If your homework is too tough,
    > and the time just flies away,
    > thinking hard is not enough,
    > click: comp.arch.fpga.
    >
    > There you find those friendly souls,
    > Austin, Philip, Peter, Ray
    > filling in your knowledge holes,
    > making problems go away.
    >
    > But learning is for you to do,
    > even if it hurts the brain.
    > The one that has to learn is you.
    > There is no substitute for pain.
    >
    > If you want to learn design
    > don't treat homework just as play.
    > Real life is not benign,
    > and you'll have to earn your pay!
    >
    > sooner or later...
    >
    > Peter Alfke
    > (originally posted a few months ago, but bears repeating.)
    >
    > kpk wrote:
    >
    > > Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    > > ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    > > am late.
    > > I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.
    > >
    > >
    Peter Alfke, Dec 31, 2003
    #5
  6. kpk

    Pete Fraser Guest

    "Peter Alfke" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > More constructively,
    > your professor wants you to:
    > 1. realize that you need four cascaded flip-flops,
    > 2. then "re-invent" the master/slave flip-flop,
    > which you can also find in old TTL databooks (7474).
    >
    > Maybe an interesting learning experience,
    > kind of like the boy-scout test of starting a fire without matches...


    I got thrown out for that.

    Potassium Permanganate and glycerine which spontaneously
    combusts and gets hot enough to light the Magnesium, which
    is hot enough to light the thermite.

    I thought it was impressive.
    Pete Fraser, Dec 31, 2003
    #6
  7. kpk

    Mac Guest

    On Wed, 31 Dec 2003 00:22:06 +0000, kpk wrote:

    > Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    > ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    > am late.
    > I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.
    >
    > PLEASE HELP !!!!!!!!!
    >
    > Thanks a lot


    Everbody is assuming that this is a clock divider. But it could be an
    arithmetic divider.

    Just thought I'd point that out.

    Mac
    Mac, Dec 31, 2003
    #7
  8. kpk

    Luhan Monat Guest

    Pete Fraser wrote:

    > "Peter Alfke" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >
    >>More constructively,
    >>your professor wants you to:
    >>1. realize that you need four cascaded flip-flops,
    >>2. then "re-invent" the master/slave flip-flop,
    >> which you can also find in old TTL databooks (7474).
    >>
    >>Maybe an interesting learning experience,
    >>kind of like the boy-scout test of starting a fire without matches...

    >
    >
    > I got thrown out for that.
    >
    > Potassium Permanganate and glycerine which spontaneously
    > combusts and gets hot enough to light the Magnesium, which
    > is hot enough to light the thermite.
    >
    > I thought it was impressive.
    >
    >

    Hey, how about amonium-tri-iodide? 15 molar amonia and iodine crystals.
    Make a slurry but dont let it dry out until you want it to explode.
    (we had a lot of fun painting this stuff in dorm-room locks)

    --
    Luhan Monat, "LuhanKnows" At 'Yahoo' dot 'Com'
    http://members.cox.net/berniekm
    "The future is not what it used to be."
    Luhan Monat, Dec 31, 2003
    #8
  9. kpk

    Ben Bradley Guest

    Jim Thompson <> responded to a deperate
    crosspost initiated by (kpk) involving:
    comp.lang.vhdl,
    comp.arch.arithmetic,
    comp.arch.fpga,
    sci.electronics.design, and
    comp.lang.verilog thusly:

    >On 31 Dec 2003 09:24:02 -0800, (Charles M.
    >Elias) wrote:
    >
    >> (kpk) wrote in message news:<>...
    >>> Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    >>> ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    >>> am late.


    An honest request for the answer to a homework assignment - I don't
    think I've ever seen this before!

    >>> I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.
    >>>
    >>> PLEASE HELP !!!!!!!!!
    >>>
    >>> Thanks a lot

    >>
    >>Sorry,
    >>
    >>I don't mind helping someone with homework if they have made a effort
    >>and are stuck. I draw the line when the student submits nothing to
    >>show that he/she has even tried to do the work. The purpose of school
    >>is not to turn in someone else's work--what do you learn from that?


    He learns, at a low level, how to cheat the system. Of course if
    there's anywhere that the phrase "you're only cheating yourself"
    totally applies, it's in school.

    >>I
    >>also have to question the utility of assigning such a problem.


    Perhaps it reinforces the concept that you can build any logic
    device out of a sufficient number of NAND (or NOR) gates?

    >>I
    >>think the professor is out of touch with reality or is a sadist.


    That's surely true of some professors, but how can you tell that
    just from what the OP said?

    >>Also, without considerable research, I cannot design such a counter
    >>using only NAND gates--not that I would want to.


    As Jim said, it's not a big deal at all. Would you rather use
    LM339's? ;)

    >>Charles

    >
    >You can't? Sheeeesh! I'm an analog designer and I can. Ever heard
    >of master-slave. Takes 9 2-in-nands (one used as an inverter) to make
    >a D-flop.


    I don't know if I'd have the patience to spend three minutes doing
    it when I know I could get a schematic that I could easily convert to
    all-NAND-all-the-time off a (don't tell the OP) "d-a-t-a s-h-e-e-t" in
    less time than that.

    > ...Jim Thompson


    Bonus question(s): How many 74(xxx)00's (quad nand gate) does it
    take to make the 4-bit divider using Jim's solution, and why is "12"
    an incorrect answer?
    -----
    http://mindspring.com/~benbradley
    Ben Bradley, Jan 1, 2004
    #9
  10. kpk

    Brian Inglis Guest

    On Wed, 31 Dec 2003 11:26:14 -0800 in comp.arch.arithmetic, "Pete
    Fraser" <> wrote:

    >
    >"Peter Alfke" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> More constructively,
    >> your professor wants you to:
    >> 1. realize that you need four cascaded flip-flops,
    >> 2. then "re-invent" the master/slave flip-flop,
    >> which you can also find in old TTL databooks (7474).
    >>
    >> Maybe an interesting learning experience,
    >> kind of like the boy-scout test of starting a fire without matches...

    >
    >I got thrown out for that.
    >
    >Potassium Permanganate and glycerine which spontaneously
    >combusts and gets hot enough to light the Magnesium, which
    >is hot enough to light the thermite.
    >
    >I thought it was impressive.


    The establishment doesn't always like creative types -- did you demo
    it or just explain it?

    --
    Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada

    (Brian dot Inglis at SystematicSw dot ab dot ca)
    fake address use address above to reply
    Brian Inglis, Jan 1, 2004
    #10
  11. > I draw the line when the student submits nothing to
    >show that he/she has even tried to do the work. The purpose of school
    >is not to turn in someone else's work--what do you learn from that?


    How to be a manager?

    I
    >also have to question the utility of assigning such a problem. I
    >think the professor is out of touch with reality or is a sadist.
    >Also, without considerable research, I cannot design such a counter
    >using only NAND gates--not that I would want to.


    counter? the OP asked for a multiplier. I could very well imagine
    asking a sketch of a multiplier with an estimate of the amount of
    gates involved. An easy solution would be a total 8->256 decoder
    followed by a 256->5 encoder.


    Wouter van Ooijen

    -- ------------------------------------
    http://www.voti.nl
    PICmicro chips, programmers, consulting
    Wouter van Ooijen, Jan 1, 2004
    #11
  12. kpk

    Tweetldee Guest

    "Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl)" <> wrote in message
    news:4all.nl...
    > > I draw the line when the student submits nothing to
    > >show that he/she has even tried to do the work. The purpose of school
    > >is not to turn in someone else's work--what do you learn from that?

    >
    > How to be a manager?
    >
    > > I also have to question the utility of assigning such a problem. I
    > >think the professor is out of touch with reality or is a sadist.
    > >Also, without considerable research, I cannot design such a counter
    > >using only NAND gates--not that I would want to.

    >
    > counter? the OP asked for a multiplier. I could very well imagine
    > asking a sketch of a multiplier with an estimate of the amount of
    > gates involved. An easy solution would be a total 8->256 decoder
    > followed by a 256->5 encoder.
    >
    > Wouter van Ooijen
    >



    Ummm take a look at the subject line of this thread.. the OP asked for a
    4-bit binary divider... 4 R-S flipflops in a chain.. no need for decoders
    (or maybe I missed something in a later post).
    --
    Tweetldee
    Tweetldee at att dot net (Just subsitute the appropriate characters in the
    address)

    Never take a laxative and a sleeping pill at the same time!!
    Tweetldee, Jan 1, 2004
    #12
  13. >Ummm take a look at the subject line of this thread.. the OP asked for a
    >4-bit binary divider... 4 R-S flipflops in a chain.. no need for decoders
    >(or maybe I missed something in a later post).


    Sorry, I mixed multiply and divide :) But are you sure he meant a
    clock divider? It could also be a binary ALU-style divider.


    Wouter van Ooijen

    -- ------------------------------------
    http://www.voti.nl
    PICmicro chips, programmers, consulting
    Wouter van Ooijen, Jan 1, 2004
    #13
  14. kpk

    DJ Guest

    On 31 Dec 2003 00:22:06 -0800, (kpk) wrote:

    >Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    > ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    >am late.
    >I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.
    >
    >PLEASE HELP !!!!!!!!!
    >
    >Thanks a lot


    If I were your prof, and I caught you blatantly trying to get others to do your
    thinking for you, I'd make you design it using nothing but BC547's, resistors
    and diodes. That way you might l-e-a-r-n something. That is why you are at uni?

    dj
    DJ, Jan 1, 2004
    #14
  15. (kpk) wrote in message news:<>...
    > Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    > ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    > am late.
    > I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.


    Your university probably has a synthesis tool for asics installed.
    Just write your design in VHDL, remove all gates from the library but
    the NAND gates and press the synthesis button.

    Kolja Sulimma

    Peter:
    Applause for the poem....
    Kolja Sulimma, Jan 1, 2004
    #15
  16. kpk

    Ben Bradley Guest

    In sci.electronics.design, (Wouter van Ooijen
    (www.voti.nl)) wrote:

    >>Ummm take a look at the subject line of this thread.. the OP asked for a
    >>4-bit binary divider... 4 R-S flipflops in a chain.. no need for decoders
    >>(or maybe I missed something in a later post).

    >
    >Sorry, I mixed multiply and divide :) But are you sure he meant a
    >clock divider? It could also be a binary ALU-style divider.


    But you can do that with nothing but NAND gates, too. ;)

    >
    >Wouter van Ooijen
    >
    >-- ------------------------------------
    >http://www.voti.nl
    >PICmicro chips, programmers, consulting


    -----
    http://mindspring.com/~benbradley
    Ben Bradley, Jan 1, 2004
    #16
  17. kpk

    Jerry Guest

    WOW, your prof let you use NANDs? we had to do this using only
    relays. Wish I had an easy prof like yours.

    :)>)

    Jer

    "Kolja Sulimma" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > (kpk) wrote in message

    news:<>...
    > > Can anyone send me a 4-bit binary divider circuit in this email :
    > > ? I must make this homework for my university and i
    > > am late.
    > > I have to make this circuit only with NAND gates.

    >
    > Your university probably has a synthesis tool for asics installed.
    > Just write your design in VHDL, remove all gates from the library but
    > the NAND gates and press the synthesis button.
    >
    > Kolja Sulimma
    >
    > Peter:
    > Applause for the poem....
    Jerry, Jan 1, 2004
    #17
  18. kpk

    Bob Perlman Guest

    On Thu, 1 Jan 2004 17:17:38 -0500, "Jerry" <> wrote:

    >WOW, your prof let you use NANDs? we had to do this using only
    >relays. Wish I had an easy prof like yours.
    >
    >:)>)
    >
    >Jer


    Hah! Luxury! When I was a boy, Professor Babbage made us use gears
    and levers! Compared to that experience, designing with today's EDA
    tools seems...well, pretty much the same, actually.

    Bob Perlman
    Cambrian Design Works
    Bob Perlman, Jan 1, 2004
    #18
  19. On Thu, 01 Jan 2004 22:53:26 GMT, the renowned Bob Perlman
    <> wrote:

    >On Thu, 1 Jan 2004 17:17:38 -0500, "Jerry" <> wrote:
    >
    >>WOW, your prof let you use NANDs? we had to do this using only
    >>relays. Wish I had an easy prof like yours.
    >>
    >>:)>)
    >>
    >>Jer

    >
    >Hah! Luxury! When I was a boy, Professor Babbage made us use gears
    >and levers! Compared to that experience, designing with today's EDA
    >tools seems...well, pretty much the same, actually.
    >
    >Bob Perlman
    >Cambrian Design Works


    You had gears and levers? We would have given our right arms for gears
    and levers! Cowrie shells was what we had, and were glad for it.


    Best regards,
    Spehro Pefhany
    --
    "it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
    Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
    Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com
    Spehro Pefhany, Jan 1, 2004
    #19
  20. In article <>,
    says...
    > On Thu, 1 Jan 2004 17:17:38 -0500, "Jerry" <> wrote:
    >
    > >WOW, your prof let you use NANDs? we had to do this using only
    > >relays. Wish I had an easy prof like yours.
    > >
    > >:)>)
    > >
    > >Jer

    >
    > Hah! Luxury! When I was a boy, Professor Babbage made us use gears
    > and levers! Compared to that experience, designing with today's EDA
    > tools seems...well, pretty much the same, actually.


    Gag, spit, choke. Damn! Don't *do* that! Now I gotta clean of
    my monitor, again.

    --
    Keith
    Keith R. Williams, Jan 2, 2004
    #20
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