Jargons of Info Tech industry

T

T Beck

John said:
T Beck said:
[snip]
alongside of it. The internet is a free-flowing evolving place... to
try to protect one little segment like usenet from ever evolving is
just ensuring it's slow death, IMHO.

And if so, who cares? As long as people hang out on Usenet it will stay.
Does Usenet need al those extra gimmicks? To me, it would be nice if a
small set would be available. But need? No.

The death of Usenet has been predicted for ages. And I see only more and
more groups, and maybe more and more people on it.

As long as people who have to say something sensible keep using it, it
will stay.
I suppose I was (as many people on the internet have a bad habit of
doing) being more caustic than was strictly necessary. I don't really
forsee the death of usenet anytime soon, I just don't think the idea of
it evolving is necessarily bad. I don't really have alot of vested
interest one way or the other, to be honest, and I'm perfectly happy
with the way it is.

I just think it's a naive view to presume it never will change, because
change is what the internet as a whole was built on.

I think I'll calmly butt out now ^_^

-- T Beck
 
A

Alan Balmer

This point I agree with. There are some situations - 'net cafes included
- - where thick e-mail clients don't work. Even so, see below.

I use Portable Thunderbird, on a USB memory stick. All I need is a USB
port and an internet connection.
 
J

John Bokma

Alan Balmer said:
I use Portable Thunderbird, on a USB memory stick. All I need is a USB
port and an internet connection.

It's a brave internetcafe that allows such things. (I mean technically one
can have a Portable Spam Device :).
 
J

John Bokma

Alan Balmer said:
My aim was simply to get it the hell off c.l.c as quickly as possible.

So you edited that one out, and decided to bother all other groups with
your ineffective attempt?
Now, go away. And please, stay away.

Like I already said, it doesn't work that way. The only way to make an
follow up effective is to write a useful contribution to the thread, and
set the follow up to the most appropriate group (and keep your fingers
crossed). Not what you did, moreover you only add noise instead of removing
it. Ignore the thread, it will end in 2-3 days. If you keep feeding it your
way it will become more and more off topic and last 5-10 days.
 
J

John Bokma

Alan Balmer said:
Goodbye, John. Filters set.

Saidly you didn't get the message. Moreover you think that the Usenet
/needs/ a public ploink message. Get a clue. People like you add more noise
to Usenet compared to a thread which runs a bit wide.
 
A

axel

Saidly you didn't get the message. Moreover you think that the Usenet
/needs/ a public ploink message. Get a clue. People like you add more noise
to Usenet compared to a thread which runs a bit wide.

Why do I think of a Dutch expression 'mieren neuker' with regards to
Balmer's posts?

Axel
 
M

Mark McIntyre

On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 11:30:19 GMT, in comp.lang.c ,
Why do I think of a Dutch expression 'mieren neuker' with regards to
Balmer's posts?

Its a complete mystery. Just as is the reason why you are x-posting
complete garbage to comp.lang.c...
 
J

John Bokma

Mark McIntyre said:
Its a complete mystery. Just as is the reason why you are x-posting
complete garbage to comp.lang.c...

A similar mystery as in why Mark clueless n00b II McIntyre thinks it's a
good idea to cross post to all other groups except comp.lang.c?

Again: stop trolling in this thread.

Let it go, it will die out in 1 or 2 days

If you keep trolling, posting your ploinks, or witty comments, it will go
on for days and days.

Mark, as a C programmer you must at least have some idea of what logic
means.
 
J

John Bokma

Alan Balmer said:
Another obnoxious cross-poster identified. Thank you.

You mean Alan clueless n00b Balmer? At least you got the follow up doesn't
work the first time. Try to get the other message I wrote as well:

ignore this thread, it will stop in 1-2 days out of itself.

If you keep feeding it, it will last much and much longer.

Or did we just met Alan the clueless n00b troll Balmer?
 
M

Mark McIntyre

A similar mystery as in why Mark clueless n00b II McIntyre thinks it's a
good idea to cross post to all other groups except comp.lang.c?

I see you felt it appropriate to RE-post this offtopic garbage back
into clc.

You sir, are a troll, and I'd claim my fiver if I could be arsed.

<plonk>
 
J

John Bokma

Mark McIntyre said:
I see you felt it appropriate to RE-post this offtopic garbage back
into clc.

You sir, are a troll,

No clueless n00b, you are a troll, or either too stupid to have a Usenet
account.
and I'd claim my fiver if I could be arsed.

<plonk>

Exactly, you and your clueless buddy think you can make smart ass
statements.

Either add something not brain dead to this thread, or let it go. As I
already explained to that other n00b, threads like this *can't* be
stopped, moved, controlled or what. The harder you try the longer it
takes for it to stop. Either ignore the whole thing, or make a useful
contribution which might make setting the FollowUp-To: header work (but
don't get angry if it's ignored).

Now lets hope that the rest gets the point. Thanks.
 
J

John Bokma

Chris Head said:
John Bokma wrote:
And workplaces. Some people have more then one computer in the house.
My partner can check her email when I had her over the computer. When
I want to check my email when she is using it, I have to change the
session, fire up Thunderbird (which eats away 20M), and change the
session back.

[ .. ]

Hmm. That would just be a matter of preference. Personally I moved my
Thunderbird profile into a shared directory and pointed everyone at
it. Now only one login session can run Thunderbird at a time, but any
login can see everyone's mailboxes.

She uses hotmail, yahoo!, etc. and I don't want her accidently delete my
email.
True. As a programmer I don't usually think about the people who never
download updates. The way I look at it, if somebody doesn't have the
latest version, they shouldn't be complaining about a bug.

A lot of non-programmers have no idea that there are bugs in their
software other then the crashing ones.
Haven't ever needed to use that program.

Some of my customers use it. It has its uses, especially the block
option :-D. (I don't believe that being available 24/7 has a positive
effect on my work).
s/form/way/

I've not seen a service that allows that. Sounds nice.

IIRC gmail does it.

[ reducing traffic ]
Eventually you reach the point where it's not bandwidth any more, it's
server load. All these things like mod_gzip, deltas, and so on add
server load.

True. On the other hand, servers get more and more powerful.
As to the point about "page not modified", it's not in the HTML spec,
content. For best results (due to clock mismatches etc), the client
should set the If-Modified-Since header to the value of the
Last-Modified header sent by the server when the page was first
requested and cached.

But feed readers, at least the one I have had a look at, seem not to
support this...
I think we can agree that in some cases, Webmail is better, and in
others, clients are better. Much of this will be personal preference,
and I would like to see ISPs offering both methods of accessing e-mail
(as mine in fact does - POP3 and Webmail).

Agreed.
 
J

John Bokma

T Beck said:
John Bokma wrote:

[ Death of Usenet has been predicted often ]
I suppose I was (as many people on the internet have a bad habit of
doing) being more caustic than was strictly necessary. I don't really
forsee the death of usenet anytime soon, I just don't think the idea of
it evolving is necessarily bad. I don't really have alot of vested
interest one way or the other, to be honest, and I'm perfectly happy
with the way it is.

me too.
I just think it's a naive view to presume it never will change, because
change is what the internet as a whole was built on.

I can't think of changes that are coming to Usenet (other then ipv6)
 
D

dave

My partner can check her email when I had her over the computer.

English is not my native language so I might misunderstand it,
but this sounds very ambiguous to me. Or is it just my dirty
mind ? :)
 
A

axel

I can't think of changes that are coming to Usenet (other then ipv6)

The old saying holds true - if it is not broken, do not fix it.

Of course what the original poster did not consider is why
the standard line length was laid down... the VT100 terminals
(and related ones) had a line length which was 80 characters
(ok, with some options to switch to 132 characters if I
remember correctly)... and that is the first machine through
which I access Usenet. And the version of vi which I used
at the time was not very good with dealing with long lines.
But it worked.

Axel
 
J

John Bokma

Of course what the original poster did not consider is why
the standard line length was laid down... the VT100 terminals
(and related ones) had a line length which was 80 characters
(ok, with some options to switch to 132 characters if I
remember correctly)... and that is the first machine through
which I access Usenet. And the version of vi which I used
at the time was not very good with dealing with long lines.
But it worked.

Technically there is word wrap, but for a lot of messages using a non-
proportional font, non-wrapped makes a lot of sense (more even), for
example program listings and ascii art :-D
 
X

Xah Lee

Perl's documentation has come of age: http://perldoc.perl.org/

Python morons really need to learn:

• ample example codes.

• example codes are linked to the appropriate doc location for each
code word in the example.

• written in a task-oriented style, or manifest-functionality style.
That is, it does not have fucking pretensions of a computer science
mode or fucking clean aloofness. It either is oriented towards tasks
programers need to do, as in module documentations, or document the
language as it manifestly functions. (e.g. input, output, side effects;
concrete description of object's methods and variables.)

The Python docs (docs.python.org), is organized in some
incomprehensible computer sciency structure that is impossible to find
anything. And the entire doc go to the extra mile to avoid any
task-oriented writing or examples as if those are pests that can lower
their fucking status. And when the Python docs tries to document its
functions, it doesn't talk straight but instead throwing fucking bunch
of abstract objects and models jargons.

--------------
The Perl documentations, at least in its presentation (organization,
focus) and technology (DHTML...) aspects, has come of age.

However, the Perl doc's content and writing per se, remains the worst
garbage possible. (and Python's is in the same ball park) The negative
aspects people want to avoid are:

• do not tech geek. Both perlers and pythoners do tech geeking. That
is, mentioning of extraneous jargons, warnings, implementation details,
little style guide here and there, unconscious opportunistic OpenSource
propaganda pitch-ins, historic information provisions, insider jokes,
author masturbation on language design and comparisons... etc. (with
Perl, this may be understandable or irrelevant because it is their
nature and design to be juvenile. They revel in it. But with Python, of
its people's computer sciency aloofness and cleanness pretensions
meanwhile don't really exhibit any ability to think and write better,
are one fucking assholes.)

• Do think clearly before writing. Both Perl and Python docs's
writing quality are extremely bad. What they primarily lack is the
ability to think clearly before writing. Perl docs write in the fashion
of happy-go-lucky juvenile ramble, and Pythoner's in the fashion of
computer sciency confoundedness. Both are incomprehensible.

One easy way to test this, is for Pythoners to read Perl docs and vice
versa.

Pythoners will find that, you really don't know what the **** the
Perlers are talking about. Same with Perler with Python docs. However,
you will not get the same feeling on well written docs, such as Java or
Mathematica. (assume that the people here have been in the programing
industry for several years, and are not familiar with the other
languages in question.)

What the Perlers & Pythoners need to do, is to horn their skills
outside of coding. Study philosophy, study economics, history, social
sciences, and mathematics. Also, study functional programing or hang
out in functional programing communities or hardcore GNU community many
also improve vastly your critical thinking and doc writing abilities.

------------
More about documentation can be found here:
http://www.xahlee.org/UnixResource_dir/writ/gubni_papri.html

Xah
(e-mail address removed)
∑ http://xahlee.org/
 

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