Python looking better ...

P

Phil Tomson

.. though they need someone to improve the grammar:

http://www.python.org/

Speaking of improved language websites... wasn't there an effort afoot (more
than a year ago I think) to improve Ruby's website? Some nice looking protoype
sites were produced, but nothing ever came of it... what gives?

BTW: we can also put "NASA uses Ruby" on our website too ;-)

Phil
 
B

Bil Kleb

Phil said:
BTW: we can also put "NASA uses Ruby" on our website too ;-)

The curious thing is that when I went to the success stories
page, and did text-search for "NASA", it came up empty?
 
K

Karl von Laudermann

Bil said:
The curious thing is that when I went to the success stories
page, and did text-search for "NASA", it came up empty?

Search for "shuttle". Or just click on the photo on the front page.
 
R

Rob Sanheim

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J

James Britt

Rob Sanheim wrote:
...>
Its still going on as far as I know, just progressing slowly. The blog is here:

http://redhanded.hobix.com/redesign2005/


Some interesting comments on Reddit about the new Python look:

http://reddit.com/info?id=2t2w



--
James Britt

http://www.ruby-doc.org - Ruby Help & Documentation
http://www.artima.com/rubycs/ - The Journal By & For Rubyists
http://www.rubystuff.com - The Ruby Store for Ruby Stuff
http://refreshingcities.org - Design, technology, usability
 
S

Steven Lumos

... though they need someone to improve the grammar:
http://www.python.org/


They got rid of that fugly "ping-pong ball" text logo, too.

IMO, the Ruby site redesign guys are on a much better track. Who
really cares whether NASA uses Python? One thing I learned from having
to sit through too many software marketing presentations is that
organizations like NASA are to software what the Library of Congress
is to books. I finally started interrupting presenters to ask
something like "Do you realize that *all* of your competitors have
LANL on their peer-pressure slide too?" Most actually didn't!

Steve
 
J

James Britt

Steven said:
IMO, the Ruby site redesign guys are on a much better track. Who
really cares whether NASA uses Python? One thing I learned from having
to sit through too many software marketing presentations is that
organizations like NASA are to software what the Library of Congress
is to books. I finally started interrupting presenters to ask
something like "Do you realize that *all* of your competitors have
LANL on their peer-pressure slide too?" Most actually didn't!

There's an argument to be made that language advocacy, and "selling"
Ruby (or Python or Lisp or whatever), is distasteful.

There's also a counterargument suggesting that the language and its
community will be better off for the greater exposure and mainstream use.

I believe that language marketing itself is fine, though it can be
poorly or distastefully done. People looking to code Ruby for a living
are helped if HR people or recruiters or whomever have heard of Ruby;
people currently trying to persuade their coworkers or boss to adopt
Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that more
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

But there is the counter-counterargument that it is more important to
attract the right kind of people, not simply large crowds of
indiscriminate coders. And that poor marketing (e.g., My language is
cool, your language is a mouse poop sandwich) will turn people off.

I'd like to think that if you make the intrinsic strengths of Ruby
obvious then it will (continue to) attract the people who will help make
it better (by keen observations, code submission, library creation),
which in turn will draw the attention of the more practical-minded.

But it may be that "success story" blurbs are still needed to win over
project managers and such.


--
James Britt

"In physics the truth is rarely perfectly clear, and that is certainly
universally the case in human affairs. Hence, what is not surrounded by
uncertainty cannot be the truth."
- R. Feynman
 
C

Cameron McBride

James,
But there is the counter-counterargument that it is more important to
attract the right kind of people, not simply large crowds of
indiscriminate coders. And that poor marketing (e.g., My language is
cool, your language is a mouse poop sandwich) will turn people off.

Nice.

I just wanted to take a moment and applaud you for your valid
contributions in amusing packages. It really does keep a lot of the
conversations fresh and educational even after years of lurking...

Thanks.

Cameron
 
L

Logan Capaldo

James said:
Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured
that more
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is
EXACTLY
the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to
justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity
passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists?
Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret
vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft?
*momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a
hovercraft* tricycles?

Pistos

It's always a bus because the bus has a long and venerable tradition
in taking out programmers.
See: http://web.archive.org/web/20000422005356/http://segfault.org/
story.phtml?mode=2&id=38b40d78-087dd360
 
V

void * clvrmnky()

Pistos said:
James said:
Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that more
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is EXACTLY
the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to
justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity
passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists?
Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret
vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft?
*momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a
hovercraft* tricycles?
Because there is no such thing (yet) as hovercraft tricycle errors, but
there are (still) bus errors.
 
W

Wilson Bilkovich

James said:
Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured that mor= e
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is EXACTLY
the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to
justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity
passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists?
Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret
vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft?
*momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a
hovercraft* tricycles?

I can't tell you how many projects I've seen fail due to
hovercraft-related issues.
 
C

Curt Hibbs

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aHMgYW5kIGl0J2xsIGJlIGFsbCBmaW5pc2hlZC4KCkN1cnQK
 
B

Benjohn Barnes

James said:
Ruby are helped if Ruby is better known and people are assured
that more
Ruby hackers can be found if a bus takes out the one or two Rubyists
they know.

I just have one question.

Why is at always a BUS that would hit Ruby programmers? This is
EXACTLY
the vehicle a former boss used in the hypothetical story he used to
justify why I shouldn't use Ruby [anymore (heh)]. Are high-capacity
passenger transport vehicles just naturally attracted to Rubyists?
Angered by them? Or maybe the Amalgamated Transit Union has a secret
vendetta against us?

Are we not worth of being hit by cars? vans? trains? hovercraft?
*momentarily tries to envision being "run over" ("blown over?") by a
hovercraft* tricycles?

I can't tell you how many projects I've seen fail due to
hovercraft-related issues.

*nods*

On a happier note, last week the team I work in took a vote on using
Ruby for development. They're a 15 strong group. A mix of developers
and QC people, about a 50-50 split, and a few managers. Their
criteria for choosing was simply "Will you be happy to maintain code
that is written in Ruby?" The majority were, so now I can happily
develop with Ruby, rather than keeping the pickaxe hidden on my knees
under my desk :)

In trying to convince them, my major selling points were that:

* Ruby is being used by other people - it's a mature language.

* Ruby has some significant advantages as a language; comes with
superb tools and modules, making it highly productive and enjoyable;
and has a vibrant and active community.

* Ruby code should be more maintainable than (in this case) Perl,
because it encourages modular, well structured design. This is far
more important to rapid understanding, than a maintainer's
familiarity with the language.

But I think I can hear the distant drone of an encroaching
hovercraft, so I will leave you, and try to finish what I can before
my appointment with destiny.

Cheers,
Benjohn
 
D

Daniel Baird

------=_Part_7584_1530844.1142165670572
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Disposition: inline


It's so you can use the phrase "bus error", which has an air of humerous
ambiguity to it. Like "carbon-based error".

;Daniel




--
Daniel Baird
http://danielbaird.com (TiddlyW;nks! :: Whiteboard Koala :: Blog :: Things
That Suck)
[[My webhost uptime is ~ 92%.. if no answer pls call again later!]]

------=_Part_7584_1530844.1142165670572--
 

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