Firefox and cache

[Jonathan N. Little]

David Graham wrote:

I have gone to the page with the free Flash Tutorials links - I'm presently
streaming the Flash movie from the site. I did Tools - page Info and it has
one line that says 'Cache Source Not Cached' which doesn't look to
hopeful. I think I'll wait for it all to reach me and then I'll use the save
as button in the info page - if I have any luck I will post again.

Not sure, since signup is required to see what you are experiencing I
cannot help you much.

One fundermental point I'm sure you could clear up for me is about the
cache. I'm starting to doubt everything I thought was true. I used to think
that the various elements that make up a web page e.g. .gif's, .jpgs etc
were stored in a cache on the hard disc e.g. Temporary Internet Files folder
for IE but now I'm thinking are these things actually on my hard disc. They
all have an internet address next to them and if you double click them they
will open OK while your connected to the internet but file not found comes
up if your not connected.

Whether something gets cached or not depends on several factors, browser
related, server related and coding. IE caches in hiding folders and the
files retain their file extensions (Windows-centric), but Firefox gives
them a coded filename, e.g., 'D9C2D4D6d01' with a hex viewer, like
WinBrowse, Hexpert or Norton's Diskedit you can see the files actual
contents (either plain text for html, css and js; or binary for images
and media and other binary data)

What's more when I browse TIF folder with Paint
Shop Pro I don't get lots of little thumbs of all the pictures. Yet I
allocate a fair chunk of my C: drive to the TIF folder so I suppose they are
there - but it seems like they are not. Please clear this up for me - this
is beginning to be a real pain!

Do not have PSP, but I think you are talking about something else. If
PSP uses Windows Explorer thumbnail generator to create the thumbs it
maybe that TIF images are not web or Windows format (GIF, JPG and MS's
BMP). Someone may have written a shell extension to add TIF to
Explorer's preview, I do not know. I do recommend IrfanViewer, a
freeware 'Swiss Army knife' image/media view and utility that has a
thumbnail feature that supports TIF plus a myriad of other formats

http://www.irfanview.com/

HTH

 

[David Graham]

David Graham wrote:


Not sure, since signup is required to see what you are experiencing I
cannot help you much.


Whether something gets cached or not depends on several factors, browser
related, server related and coding. IE caches in hiding folders

Sorry, what is 'hiding folders'?

files retain their file extensions (Windows-centric), but Firefox gives
them a coded filename, e.g., 'D9C2D4D6d01' with a hex viewer, like
WinBrowse, Hexpert or Norton's Diskedit you can see the files actual
contents (either plain text for html, css and js; or binary for images
and media and other binary data)

hex viewer?

I think your expert on this and the trouble is I'm not able to digest a lot
of it. In idiot terms, when something is cached is it then on my hard disc
somewhere when the ebrowser is IE and what if it's Firefox?

many thanks
David

 

[cwdjrxyz]

If the Flash movie plays when I'm not online and I may add plays much
better, no pausing when I'm offline, is that proof positive that it is
coming from my hard drive on my computer?

There likely is something you can do on Firefox to grab a media file,
if it has been cached, but I usually use Opera for this which seems to
be the most easy to use, at least for me. Opera 8.51 now is a
completely free download(no more paying to get rid of a banner ad), and
it is a small download.

If you have a media file embedded in a web page, often you will not be
given an option to capture it when you right click the image, for
instance a flash image. If you right click on the page away from the
image, you are given the option to download the html page or view the
source code.

On Opera, clear the cache so you will not have to look at so many files
on it. Then bring up the page with, perhaps an embedded flash movie and
play the movie if it does not start by itself. Then go to the tools tab
at the top of the Opera page and select advanced > cache. This brings
up a list of cached files, and if, for example, a flash file has been
cached, you will find a name ending with swf on the right of the page
and an Opera file name such as opr006Q4.swf on the left of the page.
You should copy this file name. Then minimize the Opera browser.Then ,
at least on my XP, you click start and select search. Paste in the file
name you copied. The search will find it on the computer. When you
double click on the left name it finds, you will be taken to the cached
file which will be displayed, and at the top of the page you will be
given the very long computer address for where the cached file is
stored. Go to this address and select to save the file where you wish
with an address that will be easy to find in the future. The reason for
leavin Opera still on, but minimized, while doing all of this is so the
cache will not be dumped before you get the file. This is not
essential, because the cache usually will not be dumped on shutdown,
and if it is you can always start over again.

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

Sorry, what is 'hiding folders'?

Sorry, fingers before brain, should be 'hidden'. Windows files have
attribute flags RASH. Folders(AKA Directories) are just files that
contain listings of a collection of filenames.

'R'eadonly - cannot be edited or deleted
'A'rchive - been changed since last backup
'S'ystem - special files used by OS
'H'idden - hide for user when Windows Explorer is on its default
settings of 'Do not show hidden files or folders' and 'Hide protected
operating system files'

hex viewer?

A file that views the actual source code of a file. Sort of peek inside
a file without having an application 'translate' or format the data,
Google viewers that I listed above for more info.

00000000 FF D8 FF E0 00 10 4A 46-49 46 00 01 01 01 01 2C......JFIF.....,
a peek inside a file show at the beginning--------------------^^^^

an ID tag in the header that is common for a JPG image... Not sure if
this is much use to you but peeking inside a file you can identify what
type of file it is even if it has the wrong/missing file extension.

I think your expert on this and the trouble is I'm not able to digest a lot
of it. In idiot terms, when something is cached is it then on my hard disc
somewhere when the ebrowser is IE and what if it's Firefox?

for both browsers there are two caches, memory and disk. Obviously you
have more disk space than memory, but memory is faster. IE, and Firefox
just use different default folder and formats for their disk caches.
Firefox just give you the ability to browser through both memory and
disk caches, as far as I know IE only lists the disk cache.

 

[kchayka]

In idiot terms, when something is cached is it then on my hard disc
somewhere when the ebrowser is IE and what if it's Firefox?

Your cache, regardless of the browser, is just a directory on your hard
disk. The browser may obfuscate the file names in the cache, but that
doesn't change the data.

By default, IE uses a directory called "Temporary Internet Files",
located in your user directory, probably something like
c:\Documents and Settings\<user>\
in the Application Data or Local Settings directory.

Firefox uses one called "cache" in your profile directory (also
somewhere in your user directory by default). You can change the cache
location if you want, though you may have to hunt and peck in browser
preferences to find the setting.

BTW, regarding learnflash.com, it seems they are only permitting
streaming for the free tutorials. If you want more, you probably gotta
pay. Can't really fault them for that.

But, if you believe these freebies are supposed to be downloadable, you
should contact them about it.

 

[Jose]

'R'eadonly - cannot be edited or deleted

'A'rchive - been changed since last backup
'S'ystem - special files used by OS
'H'idden - hide for user when Windows Explorer is on its default settings of 'Do not show hidden files or folders' and 'Hide protected operating system files'

There is actually also a "super-hidden attribute. It is slightly
different as only the extension is "super-hidden" and it is declared in
the registry (look for NeverShowExt) but can be used to disguise files.
Even when the ordinary nerd sets Windows to SHOW ALL EXTENSIONS, the
super-hidden extensions remain hidden, to the nerd's surprise (and
possible injury).

It is possible to make a file of one type look like a file of a
different type, the danger of which is immediately apparant. But more
to the point (I don't know if any browsers do this) cached files may
have an extension that is hidden, and thus appear to be something else.

Jose

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

There is actually also a "super-hidden attribute. It is slightly
different as only the extension is "super-hidden" and it is declared in
the registry (look for NeverShowExt) but can be used to disguise files.
Even when the ordinary nerd sets Windows to SHOW ALL EXTENSIONS, the
super-hidden extensions remain hidden, to the nerd's surprise (and
possible injury).

No, not really that is a registry setting applicable per file that
forces the file's file extension from showing (the characters usually 3
after the last period in a filename) even if "Hide extensions for known
file types" is deselected

<soapbox>
Personally I advise even noobies to disable this stupid Windows default,
Mr Bill is under the impression that the average Joe cannot fathom that
the 3 little characters can id what type of file is. Hence we get such
lame spoofing in Windows as

"readme.txt .pif"
(Yep, those are spaces between the 'txt' and '.pif')

filenames that bugger folks!

It is possible to make a file of one type look like a file of a
different type, the danger of which is immediately apparant. But more
to the point (I don't know if any browsers do this) cached files may
have an extension that is hidden, and thus appear to be something else.

Sure thing! Only need to take a plain old text file and rename it with
an executable file extension to prove it when you double click it. Get
the right character combination within the file and you can do some real
damage!

 

[Jose]

No, not really that is a registry setting applicable per file

Ok, it's not an "attribute" per se. But it's also not per file either -
it is per extension, or per file type.

Personally I advise even noobies to disable this stupid Windows default

Me too. But be aware that when thou hast done, thou hast not done. For
there is more.

Jose

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

Ok, it's not an "attribute" per se. But it's also not per file either -
it is per extension, or per file type.

mistyped, meant per filetype

Me too. But be aware that when thou hast done, thou hast not done. For
there is more.

Must be a little slow, not sure what you mean there....my point was
specific to hiding the file extensions on know file type, especially
with GUI's (not just Windows) proclivity for 'icons' as the default file
management view invites such deceptive practices to lure the naive into
infecting their systems. Hiding the systems files is probably a good
thing for many users....

 

[Jose]

Me too. But be aware that when thou hast done, thou hast not done. For there is more.

Must be a little slow, not sure what you mean there.

Because of the NeverShowExt registry setting, it is not sufficient to
uncheck the "hide extensions..." box. Both newbies and nerds will
believe that having done this, they will see the correct extension on
all file types.

'tain't so.

Hiding the systems files is probably a good thing for many users....

Agreed. But showing a file in disguise is different from not showing a
file at all.

Jose

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

Because of the NeverShowExt registry setting, it is not sufficient to
uncheck the "hide extensions..." box. Both newbies and nerds will
believe that having done this, they will see the correct extension on
all file types.

CMD
DIR /X


<snip>

 

[Jose]

CMD

DIR /X

or right-click, properties. (at least on Win 98 - I think NT has mucked
that up too). Point is, you have to look for it.

Jose

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

or right-click, properties. (at least on Win 98 - I think NT has mucked
that up too). Point is, you have to look for it.

Jose

Not on Win2K or WinXP

 

[cwdjrxyz]

If you have a media file embedded in a web page, often you will not be
given an option to capture it when you right click the image, for
instance a flash image. If you right click on the page away from the
image, you are given the option to download the html page or view the
source code.

On Opera, clear the cache so you will not have to look at so many files
on it. Then bring up the page with, perhaps an embedded flash movie and
play the movie if it does not start by itself. Then go to the tools tab
at the top of the Opera page and select advanced > cache. This brings
up a list of cached files, and if, for example, a flash file has been
cached, you will find a name ending with swf on the right of the page
and an Opera file name such as opr006Q4.swf on the left of the page.
You should copy this file name. Then minimize the Opera browser.Then ,
at least on my XP, you click start and select search. Paste in the file
name you copied. The search will find it on the computer. When you
double click on the left name it finds, you will be taken to the cached
file which will be displayed, and at the top of the page you will be
given the very long computer address for where the cached file is
stored. Go to this address and select to save the file where you wish
with an address that will be easy to find in the future. The reason for
leavin Opera still on, but minimized, while doing all of this is so the
cache will not be dumped before you get the file. This is not
essential, because the cache usually will not be dumped on shutdown,
and if it is you can always start over again.

You must have your hidden files turned on to navigate to where your
opera cache images are stored. In case your's are turned off and you do
not see an icon for a file you need to navigate to the cache, some
files you need likely are hidden. Here is how you display the hidden
file icons on the Windows XP. Procedures will be a bit different on
other OSs.

Start > control panel > Appearance and Themes > Folder Options > View
Tab > Hidden Files and Folders > select bullet to display hidden files.
I leave my hidden files displayed all of the time, and it does not add
much clutter. However doing things to the contents of some hidden files
without knowing exactly what you are doing can cause serious problems
with the computer, so it might be a good idea to keep the hidden files
hidden if more than one person uses the computer.

 

[David Graham]

But, if you believe these freebies are supposed to be downloadable, you
should contact them about it.

I tried to contact them but they have an elaborate system - I need a ticket
or something from thier help desk - gave up. They do seem to suggest that
the video can be wathced off line but I've spent far too long trying. I did
get a suggestion that right click on the link and 'Save Target As' would
work but it just saves the html page that houses the links. What confuses me
is it is possible to watch the videos offline because I've just done it in
Opera but I lose them when I close Opera.
thanks
David

 

[David Graham]

On Opera, clear the cache

C:\Program Files\Opera\profile\cache4
Sorry, being a bit thick here - please how do I clear the cache. Surely
there is a button so I don't have to navigate to the folder and delete the
files there.
thanks
David

 

[Steve Pugh]

C:\Program Files\Opera\profile\cache4
Sorry, being a bit thick here - please how do I clear the cache. Surely
there is a button so I don't have to navigate to the folder and delete the
files there.

Assuming a relatively recent version of Opera.
Tools > Delete Private Data
Select Advanced to pick which options to delete (in case you don't want
to delete your history, etc. at the same time as you delete your
cache).

Or

Tools > Preferences > Advanced > History > Disk Cache > Empty Now

Steve

 

[David Graham]

Assuming a relatively recent version of Opera.
Tools > Delete Private Data
Select Advanced to pick which options to delete (in case you don't want
to delete your history, etc. at the same time as you delete your
cache).

Or

Tools > Preferences > Advanced > History > Disk Cache > Empty Now

Steve

Thanks steve

 

[David Graham]

There likely is something you can do on Firefox to grab a media file,
if it has been cached, but I usually use Opera for this which seems to
be the most easy to use, at least for me. Opera 8.51 now is a
completely free download(no more paying to get rid of a banner ad), and
it is a small download.

If you have a media file embedded in a web page, often you will not be
given an option to capture it when you right click the image, for
instance a flash image. If you right click on the page away from the
image, you are given the option to download the html page or view the
source code.

On Opera, clear the cache so you will not have to look at so many files
on it. Then bring up the page with, perhaps an embedded flash movie and
play the movie if it does not start by itself. Then go to the tools tab
at the top of the Opera page and select advanced > cache. This brings
up a list of cached files, and if, for example, a flash file has been
cached, you will find a name ending with swf on the right of the page
and an Opera file name such as opr006Q4.swf on the left of the page.
You should copy this file name. Then minimize the Opera browser.Then ,
at least on my XP, you click start and select search. Paste in the file
name you copied. The search will find it on the computer. When you
double click on the left name it finds, you will be taken to the cached
file which will be displayed, and at the top of the page you will be
given the very long computer address for where the cached file is
stored. Go to this address and select to save the file where you wish
with an address that will be easy to find in the future. The reason for
leavin Opera still on, but minimized, while doing all of this is so the
cache will not be dumped before you get the file. This is not
essential, because the cache usually will not be dumped on shutdown,
and if it is you can always start over again.

Many thanks - your explanation works, I find the name of the opera file eg
opr006Q4.swf by the method you stated above and then I simply go to the
folder cache4 and move the file to My Documents
many thanks to everyone who replied
David