It does not look good for Target. Web Accessibility news

[Jerry Stuckle]

Why should it have? Because you don't like Flash?

When all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

I happen to agree. Flash is good for some things. But this could have
been easily done without it. And I think it should have been.

It would have been smaller and faster. It could have been spidered by
the search engines (probably not applicable in this particular case).

But most of all, it would have been accessible to the blind.


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JDS Computer Training Corp.
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[Chaddy2222]

Why should it have? Because you don't like Flash?

Not really, it's just that it would have been a lot quicker to develop
useing HTML / CSS and PHP then it would have been useing Flash.
Oh yeah and I would have been able to read the bloody thing.

 

[Karl Groves]

Disable JS. It is the only way to view the site without interruption.

Or just click away, which is exactly what I did.

 

[Karl Groves]

Popups? I saw one on the menu page, and only the first time I
visited it. After that, none.

Silly me. Somehow my NoScript extension in Firefox had gotten set to "Allow
Scripts Globally".

::Looks over at wife, suspiciously::

 

[SpaceGirl]

Not really, it's just that it would have been a lot quicker to develop
useing HTML / CSS and PHP then it would have been useing Flash.

Doubt it. This site was built in Flex. In other words a proper drag
and drop IDE. Most of the components used (the content panels,
scrollbars, graphs etc) are standard. Most of the UI was probably
described in MXML with small bits of code, rather than reams of code
to do everything. I suspect this site took a fraction of the time
compared to building by hand in PHP.

Oh yeah and I would have been able to read the bloody thing.

Well... there is that

 

[SpaceGirl]

When all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.


I happen to agree. Flash is good for some things. But this could have
been easily done without it.

Yep... maybe

And I think it should have been.

Possibly. Really Flash doesn't bring anything to this particular site.

It would have been smaller and faster.

I'm not sure about that. It would be interesting to time the site.

It could have been spidered by
the search engines (probably not applicable in this particular case).

Google etc can spider well constructed Flash movies.

But most of all, it would have been accessible to the blind.

Yes

They could have easily added the facility though.

 

[Travis Newbury]

Not really, it's just that it would have been a lot quicker to develop
useing HTML / CSS and PHP then it would have been useing Flash.
Oh yeah and I would have been able to read the bloody thing.

It would have been faster for YOU to develop it in HTML/CSS/PHP. You
don't know how to develop a flash application so you can not say it is
a slower development process.

Oh yeah and I would have been able to read the bloody thing.

Zoom.... (Yes I know the zoom feature sucks)

 

[Chaddy2222]

Yep... maybe


Possibly. Really Flash doesn't bring anything to this particular site.


I'm not sure about that. It would be interesting to time the site.


Google etc can spider well constructed Flash movies.


Yes

They could have easily added the facility though.- Hide quoted text -

Take a look at:
http://www.websiteoptimization.com/services/analyze/wso.php
That might answer the questions about loading faster.

 

[Jerry Stuckle]

Yep... maybe


Possibly. Really Flash doesn't bring anything to this particular site.


I'm not sure about that. It would be interesting to time the site.


Google etc can spider well constructed Flash movies.


Yes

They could have easily added the facility though.

And if they did it in plain css/html, they would have everything they do
now, but wouldn't have to add it.

--
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Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
(e-mail address removed)
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[Jerry Stuckle]

It would have been faster for YOU to develop it in HTML/CSS/PHP. You
don't know how to develop a flash application so you can not say it is
a slower development process.

Zoom.... (Yes I know the zoom feature sucks)

So are you saying it is NOT faster to develop in HTML/CSS/PHP? Or are
you just blowing hot air?

The fact is - whether you like it or not - this is a lousy application
for flash. And every one of those reasons you dismiss so handily show
how closed minded you really are.

I'm not saying flash isn't worthwhile. But unlike you, I don't think
it's applicable to everything - and certainly not here.


--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
(e-mail address removed)
==================

 

[SpaceGirl]

Take a look at:http://www.websiteoptimization.com/services/analyze/wso.php
That might answer the questions about loading faster.

Hardly... it doesn't understand Flash!

 

[Chaddy2222]

Hardly... it doesn't understand Flash!

Hmmm, maybe it's becuase of the frames and such? I know the site can
handle normal SWF files.

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

A "Shocker" Hardly.

Should have? We can not tell because we do not know the audience well
enough to make that decision.

Could have, absolutely. The company and developers need to understand
what their visitors want. You don't know, there may have been a
calling for this.

BS. Nearly 4 minutes before I could see anything. As a client I assume I
would be interested in mortgages, not dancing animated squirrels or
whatever. So while I'm watching a progress bar instead of getting
mortgage rates I can get the info a www.lendingtree.com in 24 seconds.

Now I if I cannot read the text on mortgagenews2.com, well I'm screwed.
lendingtree.com also has stupid pixel-fixed design, but with
lendingtree.com I can dump their lousy CSS and bump the font size up and
read it if I wish.

Yes the deziner does not have ultimate control of the styling as with
flash, but then a potential customer doesn't have to be driving away
because of some poor design decisions made by the said deziner!

 

[SpaceGirl]

Hmmm, maybe it's becuase of the frames and such? I know the site can
handle normal SWF files.

Oh, okay! That would make sense. Wonder how it calculates content that
Flash is internally loading? Regardless - useful site that.

 

[SpaceGirl]

BS. Nearly 4 minutes before I could see anything. As a client I assume I
would be interested in mortgages, not dancing animated squirrels or
whatever. So while I'm watching a progress bar instead of getting
mortgage rates I can get the info awww.lendingtree.comin 24 seconds.

Now I if I cannot read the text on mortgagenews2.com, well I'm screwed.
lendingtree.com also has stupid pixel-fixed design, but with
lendingtree.com I can dump their lousy CSS and bump the font size up and
read it if I wish.

Yes the deziner does not have ultimate control of the styling as with
flash, but then a potential customer doesn't have to be driving away
because of some poor design decisions made by the said deziner!

Well I agree. Bad design is bad design!

 

[Chaddy2222]

Oh, okay! That would make sense. Wonder how it calculates content that
Flash is internally loading? Regardless - useful site that.

It is good, Oh and I didn't even think of the Flash Internally loading
stuff thing (it's kind of new to Flash as I understand) but it
probably treats it like some of the CSS related propities / files.
I think the entire system just works by grabbing the size of the file
and calculating how long it would take vire the various download
speeds, perhaps kind of similar to how those broadband speed test
thingies work.

 

[Jonathan N. Little]

On Oct 8, 8:41 am, Chaddy2222 <[email protected]>
wrote:
Zoom.... (Yes I know the zoom feature sucks)

Hmmm, apparently the deziner forgot to enable the feature. Sorry Chad
you're screwed! You'll be coming back to the site with some youngin with
fresh perfect eyes in tow to read off the pages for you, right? Yeah,
sure...


Not saying there is no use for flash, but dammit it is not better than
html for conveying textual content on the web. Whether it better than
server-side for organizing and disseminating the content is also
debatable since in most cases the end result is neither delivered to
displayed on the browser any faster nor as flexible is usability once it
gets there! The swf of this site www.mortgagenews2.com maybe only 27Kb
but that cannot be the whole story. A lot more must have been
parsed|processed to take 4+ minutes to display the friggin textual page
on a dialup connection.

 

[Duende]

On 08 Oct 2007 Karl Groves wrote in alt.html

::Looks over at wife, suspiciously::

So where is your Chevelle cam?

 

[Chaddy2222]

Hmmm, apparently the deziner forgot to enable the feature. Sorry Chad
you're screwed! You'll be coming back to the site with some youngin with
fresh perfect eyes in tow to read off the pages for you, right? Yeah,
sure...

Not saying there is no use for flash, but dammit it is not better than
html for conveying textual content on the web. Whether it better than
server-side for organizing and disseminating the content is also
debatable since in most cases the end result is neither delivered to
displayed on the browser any faster nor as flexible is usability once it
gets there! The swf of this sitewww.mortgagenews2.commaybe only 27Kb

That's f***ing jygantic!.
My XHTML docs with a lot of images would equal about 10KB I reckon.
</goes and checks>.
No, actually I have a layout for a photo gallery page with about 10
thumbnails that ways in at about 2KB!
now try and do that with your fancy bandwith eating Flash
applications!

 

[Travis Newbury]

BS. Nearly 4 minutes before I could see anything. As a client I assume I
would be interested in mortgages, not dancing animated squirrels or
whatever....

We have already established your connection sucks and you hate flash.
I personally think you are just crying sour grapes and think you are
pissed that we can all enjoy Flash just fine. You just don't want
anyone else to enjoy something you are not capable of enjoying. (I am
being facetious)

So while I'm watching a progress bar instead of getting
mortgage rates I can get the info awww.lendingtree.comin 24 seconds.

Then you should go there. That will teach these guys a lesson!

Now I if I cannot read the text on mortgagenews2.com, well I'm screwed.
lendingtree.com also has stupid pixel-fixed design, but with
lendingtree.com I can dump their lousy CSS and bump the font size up and
read it if I wish.

Again, it is your prerogative to head to lending tree.

Yes the deziner does not have ultimate control of the styling as with
flash, but then a potential customer doesn't have to be driving away
because of some poor design decisions made by the said deziner!

And as time goes on, if that seems to be a problem with this site,
and they start losing money because of the designer, they will either
have to change or go out of business. I seriously doubt either will
happen.

This is the great thing about the free market. If there is a gap
somewhere that will make money, someone will fill the gap. There is
little need for government regulation. The free market system is self
regulating.