VS2005 is a PIECE of Garbage and is bug Ridden

[Rob Dob]

Speedwise my same app use to run twice as fast when compiled with Borland's
over being compiled with MSC5.0, I have only done ddk development using MSC
so I have nothing to compare, I have never thought of Microsoft having
great products, just great marketing, as they are now once again doing with
FREE express versions, Trust Microsoft they know how to knock out the
competition... even look at msword, was the biggest piece of junk back in
the days that WordPerfect was king. now its all everyone hears about...
Or OS2, far superior to Stable XP which confuses easily and dies,
Microsoft should spend more time building better more stable products
instead of spending it trying to steal apple's ipod patent. anyway I
realise this is not the newsgroup for this topic so please forgive me, I
will refrain in future..

thanks

 

[Danny Tuppeny]

VS2005 is a PIECE of Garbage and is bug Ridden, I wonder how many others
feel the same, I am so sorry that I have moved away from VS2003,

VS2005 is unstable, and half the stuff doesn't work, Microsft has spent so
much time trying to make it simply that when you try to do something useful
with it it doesn't work...

<snip>

Maybe you should use the free Express versions - I've not had a single
problem with either VWD and VC#! ;-)

 

[Kevin Spencer]

Hi Karl,

There's a lot more to the IDE than meets the eye at first. I've been using
it for quite a few months, and I'm continuing to discover cool things about
it. For example, the XSL editor is extremely cool. You can actually step
through an XSL file, perform watches, etc., to debug it. This is a very big
thing, even though a lot of people don't realize it quite yet, kind of like
the reason that XHTML is very powerful, but underappreciated. But over the
next few years, XML is going to be discovered by a lot of people who haven't
yet realized its true potential. The XSD tools are also very cool. The
syntax checking and Intellisense for XML is really nice. It uses DTDs to
perform syntax checks on the fly. The JavaScript debugging tools are also
improved. Code Snippets are very cool. The Document Outline feature is very
helpful. Refactoring is excellent, and you don't need to use any third-party
add-ons to get it. The MSBuild engine is very powerful.

And like I said, I'm not sure I've scratched much more than the surface. A
lot of the stuff is not obvious. There are lots of small improvements in
general, rather than the big headlines new features.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
If you push something hard enough,
it will fall over.
- Fudd's First Law of Opposition

 

[Rob Dob]

Hi,

thanks, I tried that but they do not support the addition of the
SQLDataAdapter to the toolbar via "Choose Items", but thank you anyway..

 

[Kevin Spencer]

Hey, maybe I spent so many years making chicken salad out of chicken s**t
that when I got my hands on some good tools I became a chicken salad
super-chef. But I can make chicken salad with my eyes closed using this
stuff, and it doesn't have that nasty aftertaste!

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
If you push something hard enough,
it will fall over.
- Fudd's First Law of Opposition

 

[Rob Dob]

I became a chicken salad super-chef. But I can make chicken salad with my

eyes closed using this stuff

I aspire one day to also becoming a "chicken salad super chef", I was only
trying to state that what works for one person doesn't need work for the
other..

 

[Scott Allen]

The SQLDataAdapter is no longer available by
default in the toolbox, when you add it in and then try to make use of it
my application no longer works, However if you do the same on a winform
then everything works fine, I'm only referring to the webforms and c#
within webforms.

This could be a large part of your problem. The SqlDataAdapter doesn't
belong in the toolbox for a web form.

If you want to design table adapters, add a strongly typed DataSet to
the project and work with the typed DataSet designer. This designer is
the square hole for your square peg.

 

[Ken Cox]

What does MS Support say about your problems?

Don't forget that your purchase includes free support incidents and perhaps
even a money-back guarantee.

 

[carion1]

I challenge the complainers to write something better. Can't? Then quit
crying about something that has been released for a month. If you have been
doing this for more than 2 weeks then you should know Microsoft well enough
to wait for the first service pack before even thinking about switching.

 

[Frans Bouma [C# MVP]]

VS2005 is a PIECE of Garbage and is bug Ridden, I wonder how many
others feel the same, I am so sorry that I have moved away from
VS2003,

VS2005 is unstable, and half the stuff doesn't work, Microsft has
spent so much time trying to make it simply that when you try to do
something useful with it it doesn't work...

Half the time it crashes, and menu items appear for things you
cannot do. For example, Go into component designer, or
SQLDataAdapter component for WebForms is junk, doesn't come
installed, so you add it to the toolbar and it doesn't work, it
breaks webforms.

I guess this is now a good system for doing things the microsoft way,
but build anytihng decent and forget it..,

VS2005 is a WASTE of MONEY.. I advise all to NOT upgrade, grab
yourself the express additons the FREE versions, at least you won't
feel so riped...

While I found some bugs in it which one actually locked up the IDE, it
is overall not that buggy. Slow, ok, but not buggy.

What I know is that if you had Beta2 on your system prior to
installing vs.net 2005 rtm and you didn't gothrough all the uninstall
crap (simply uninstalling beta2 isn't enough), you will experience
crashes and problems.

So my question to you is: did you have beta2 installed on that same
machine and did you go through the uninstall misery of beta2 BEFORE
installing vs.net rtm?

FB

--

 

[Frans Bouma [C# MVP]]

I challenge the complainers to write something better. Can't? Then
quit crying about something that has been released for a month. If
you have been doing this for more than 2 weeks then you should know
Microsoft well enough to wait for the first service pack before even
thinking about switching.

That's the most stupid analogy I've heard in years. "You have an
opinion? Oh, do it better!". yeah right.

So you never ever had a problem with ANY product you bought? I think
you have, everyone has. So, at that moment, you simply thought: "Oh
well, I can't complain, I can't do it better alone, myself" ? I bet you
didn't. "Oh my brand new XBox 360 doesn't work, oh well, I can't do it
better myself, so bummer..."

ALso, your babbling about service packs is not born in reality. VS.NET
2003 has a lot of bugs too (ever seen your custom user controls
dissapear on a winform?, or your asp.net source getting messed up
beyond repair? or suddenly your asp.net event handlers were gone? or C#
intellisense suddenly stops working in a property? etc.etc.) but never
has there been a service pack, left alone a single public patch.

If someone pays money for a product and it doesn't behave as expected,
the customer can complain to the producer of the product that it
doesn't behave as expected and the producer has to fix it. That's
simple stuff a 6 year old child even understands.

I'm not agreeing with the statement 'vs.net 2005 is a load of crap',
but I simply also refuse to agree with garbage statements like yours
either. If something doesn't work, it has to be fixed.

I filed a couple of bugs for vs.net 2005 since its RTM release. One
was a misery with splitter bars and scroll bars which lock up when you
close VS.NET 2005 when the solution has a code editor splitter
open/tabgroups. It was closed yesterday as 'won't fix' because MS
thinks it's too much work to fix it.

I was simply stunned. It takes me a couple of minutes to get it back
into gear and it's clearly a bug. Now you can come to me and tell me I
should do better or else shut up, but I hope you'll see how rediculus
that will be.

FB

--

 

[Kevin Spencer]

Man, it's getting hot in here...

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
If you push something hard enough,
it will fall over.
- Fudd's First Law of Opposition

 

[carion1]

YOU know Microsoft's track record with new products. YOU chose to adopt the
product early. YOU are now complaining because it has some issues. The
common thing here seems to be YOU. You know the stove is hot. If you put
your hand on the stove, who' fault is it?

Sure we would all love to see more stable products at release from MS but
that hasn't been their track record. Adapt and move forward.

 

[john]

I think VS2005 is a great tool and I applaud MS for listening to
developers and adding much needed features.

HOWEVER...

Who asked for some of the rediculous changes to Asp.net. For example:

A web app is not a project ?
Deploy source code to production and have it compiled on the fly ? Why
not deploy your source with WinForms too (sarcasm) ?
Little control over the generated assemblies, (name, version, etc)?
Randomly named assemblies per page, app_code, etc ?
Can't add a project reference to a web app?
Etc, etc, etc.

I think they had some great ideas, but the implementation fell short.

John Powell

 

[Scott Allen]

I think VS2005 is a great tool and I applaud MS for listening to
developers and adding much needed features.

HOWEVER...

Who asked for some of the rediculous changes to Asp.net. For example:

A web app is not a project ?
Deploy source code to production and have it compiled on the fly ? Why
not deploy your source with WinForms too (sarcasm) ?
Little control over the generated assemblies, (name, version, etc)?
Randomly named assemblies per page, app_code, etc ?
Can't add a project reference to a web app?
Etc, etc, etc.

Most of the issues you list here can be addressed with the web
deployment project.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/asp.net/reference/infrastructure/wdp/default.aspx

Even without the WDP, you don't have to upload any source code to the
server - you can precompile the entire application, which is a step
further than 1.x days.

 

[Alvin Bruney - ASP.NET MVP]

Microsoft should spend more time building better more stable products

instead of spending it trying to steal apple's ipod patent.

Get your facts straight. MS owns the patent, not apple.

--
Regards,
Alvin Bruney [MVP ASP.NET]

[Shameless Author plug]
The Microsoft Office Web Components Black Book with .NET
Now Available @ www.lulu.com/owc
Forth-coming VSTO.NET - Wrox/Wiley 2006

 

[Rob Dob]

Get your facts straight. MS owns the patent, not apple.
yes, swift thinking on Gates part, I don't think gates has ever owned
anything that wasn't there before.. Look at SQL Server orginally SYSBASE,
orginally from UofWaterloo ( Canada )

anyway not the forum for this...

"lets just agree to disagree!!

thanks for the enlightenment..

 

[Frans Bouma [C# MVP]]

YOU know Microsoft's track record with new products. YOU chose to
adopt the product early. YOU are now complaining because it has some
issues. The common thing here seems to be YOU. You know the stove
is hot. If you put your hand on the stove, who' fault is it?

I'm not complaining, I just stated it has some bugs. I don't see any
logic in not doing that.

So your reasoning now switched from 'don't complain if you can't do it
better' to 'don't complain because it's brand new' ? What if I have to
do development on .NET 2.0 and can't wait for Q2 2006 before the
service pack is here? Ever thought of that? What if the service pack
gets delayed till doomsday, like the ever promised service pack for
vs.net 2003?

Sure we would all love to see more stable products at release from MS
but that hasn't been their track record. Adapt and move forward.

Who says I'm not adapting? I just can't stand smart-a$$es who tell the
world everybody should shut up because they can't do it better
themselves, because those smarts don't realize that stating it has some
bugs isn't the same as shouting "IT'S CRAP!!!111"

If I type text into a textbox/editor, I just want the textbox/editor
to accept the characters I type. If it then hangsup the program, the
editor is apparently flawed in a way for example Notepad isn't. Silly
analogy, I know, but it servers the point: accepting text into an
editor is a very silly dumb task and the core purpose of an editor.
ABOVE EVERYTHING ELSE, the typed in text should be accepted. So if it
then hangs/crashes, is it stupid to say "It has a bug" ? I don't think
so. It simply states: it has a bug, so be aware of it.

I hope you're not part of the group of programmers who's still in that
corner desperately waiting for the vs.net 2003 service pack so they can
start programming with vs.net 2003.

I also never said everything should be bugfree. That's impossible to
achieve. So with that FACT the vendor has to live with and also has to
ADAPT -> develop a stategy so customers aren't hurt by the bugs which
are inevitably there.

Up till now Microsoft has done a terribly job in that department, when
it comes to visual studio.net, the application millions of developers
have to work with 8-10 hours A DAY.

They've promissed to improve their act, and Soma personally promissed
me they will do so, so I hope he'll uphold his promisse. We'll see in
about 6 months time.

For the IDE hang bug, a KB is released soon. However not a public fix.
This is the stuff I'm talking about: it's a work-losing critical bug,
but the fix won't be made publically available and to find it you've to
wade through the terrible KB search engine. Not what I call 'helping
customers'.

So before you start arguing again people should shut up or do it
better themselves, also look at the other side: Microsoft and tell them
they should get their act together as well, because enough is enough.

FB

--

 

[Sylvain Lafontaine]

You can add a project reference to a web app. but before that, you have to
add the project to the current solution.

 

[john]

IMHO that is a loss of functionality. I should be able to reference
the assembly as I could in 2003. There is nothing fundamentally
different about a web assembly and a class library assembly and I don't
like the new approach to web projects.