Databases: Where is a newbie to start?

[Nabusman]

I am rather new to C++, started programming a month ago as a hobby. At
this point I have a decent grasp of the basics of C++ and am interested
in building a program which calculates some statistics using data
values. I am told the best way to go about it is to import the data
into a database and proceed from there. My question is where do I
begin? Any sites, books?

Thank you,

Nabs

 

[roberts.noah]

I am rather new to C++, started programming a month ago as a hobby. At
this point I have a decent grasp of the basics of C++ and am interested
in building a program which calculates some statistics using data
values. I am told the best way to go about it is to import the data
into a database and proceed from there. My question is where do I
begin? Any sites, books?

Why not ask the guy that suggested it if they think it is such a hot
idea??!! I would think they would have some idea on how to get started
if they really know wtf they are talking about and bviously they know
more about your program too since they would have to in order to make
such a suggestion.

You could also start by picking a database and learning the API to talk
to it. Ask questions about that API in an appropriate newsgroup or
other support line.

 

[=?iso-8859-1?q?Stephan_Br=F6nnimann?=]

I am rather new to C++, started programming a month ago as a hobby. At
this point I have a decent grasp of the basics of C++ and am interested
in building a program which calculates some statistics using data
values. I am told the best way to go about it is to import the data
into a database and proceed from there. My question is where do I
begin? Any sites, books?

Thank you,

Nabs

Check out OTL by Sergei Kuchin, otl.sourceforge.net. He provides a lot
of examples.

Regards, Stephan

 

[Ian Collins]

I am rather new to C++, started programming a month ago as a hobby. At
this point I have a decent grasp of the basics of C++ and am interested
in building a program which calculates some statistics using data
values. I am told the best way to go about it is to import the data
into a database and proceed from there. My question is where do I
begin? Any sites, books?

Why complicate things?

If you are learning C++, store your data in a text file and learn to
manipulate that. If your application reaches a level of complexity that
requires a database, use one.

Start simple with something like a CSV file, easy to parse in C++ and
easy to import to a database later if you have to.

For what you are doing, I doubt you will ever have to go that far.

 

[Tom]

I am rather new to C++, started programming a month ago as a hobby. At
this point I have a decent grasp of the basics of C++ and am interested
in building a program which calculates some statistics using data
values. I am told the best way to go about it is to import the data
into a database and proceed from there. My question is where do I
begin? Any sites, books?

Thank you,

Nabs

If you were instantly bestowed expert programming knowledge ... what
would you do with it? Would you write database programs? Would you
analyze stock market data? Create a graphics editing program? Write
your own word processor? What is your dream? Start tiny and realistic.
Then slowly add more functionality.

I personally do not like the beginner books for C++ that throw you
into windows style programming. Dialog boxes, all the various radio
buttons and such, blah blah blah. But then for some folks ... that is
exactly what they want to do. The ability to have a program dazzle you
with graphics is their magic juice.

So again, what is your dream?

That is where you begin.

Some folks are happy using optical character recognition scanning,
word processors, photo editing programs, creating HTML web pages,
spread sheet analysis with charts and graphs, designing with Autocad,
etc. In other words ... using packaged programs in a way that allows
them a relatively easy path towards an end result. They use the tools
instead of making the tools.

What is your dream?

 

[osmium]

I am rather new to C++, started programming a month ago as a hobby. At
this point I have a decent grasp of the basics of C++ and am interested
in building a program which calculates some statistics using data
values. I am told the best way to go about it is to import the data
into a database and proceed from there. My question is where do I
begin? Any sites, books?

It seems to me that you might have been given bad advice. There is no
inherent linkage between statistics and data bases. Why introduce a
digression and a layer of obfuscation? If you want a source of statistics
for test purposes you might be able to tag along on some college course and
filch their data set from a student assignment on the Web. Lacking that, a
lot of (most?) statistics texts have data sets that could be typed in
manually in a few minutes. For many purposes, you probably don't even need
a letter perfect copy. This would take a *lot* less time than learning
about data bases.

 

[JustBoo]

I am rather new to C++, started programming a month ago as a hobby. At
this point I have a decent grasp of the basics of C++ and am interested
in building a program which calculates some statistics using data
values. I am told the best way to go about it is to import the data
into a database and proceed from there. My question is where do I
begin? Any sites, books?

Well, I'll actually answer your question. Note I am going with
probabilities here - you know, the 90-10 rule.

Try OO4O. It's a high-level object-oriented class library that ships
with Oracle. It wraps the OCI low-level API. You need to know some
SQL and C++. No GUI is required.

This should get you started.
http://www.orafaq.com/faqoo4o.htm

Disregard their emphasis on MFC. There is a stand-alone C++ class
library in there. Btw, Oracle gives away a Personal Version of their
DB. Search Google.

Otherwise, here are a bunch of free databases and utilities. Linux
included. (One for the language lawyers.)
http://www.thefreecountry.com/sourcecode/database.shtml

A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't
change the subject. - Winston Churchill

 

[roberts.noah]

Well, I'll actually answer your question. Note I am going with
probabilities here - you know, the 90-10 rule.

You may think you are being helpful but in the end you are probably
just sending this guy on a wild goose chace.

Try OO4O. It's a high-level object-oriented class library that ships
with Oracle. It wraps the OCI low-level API. You need to know some
SQL and C++. No GUI is required.

Oracle is a highly developed RDBMS used by data wharhouses and others
requiring the storage and retrieval of vast stores of information. It
is a very high end solution and is priced accordingly. For a project
being developed by someone starting a month ago this is probably MAJOR
overkill. Your "90-10" rule might apply, but it appears to apply
inversly to how you are using it; of course we can't know since the OP
neither specified the problem domain nor the target architecture.

In reality the responses telling this person that they are in the wrong
newsgroup are more beneficial. In fact any attempt at answering the
OP's actual question is certain to be counterproductive since there is
not adiquate information to do so reasonably. This is why I
recommended that they talk to the person they originally consulted;
this person knows more about the problem and obviously has some idea
how to go about solving it.

For one thing the OP needs to decide what, if any, RDBMS to use and
find support for that API; they are simply in the wrong place for that.
There are too many choices available for us to make assumptions as to
his needs and tell them, "Go here." We don't even know if his friend's
advice was good or not; maybe a database is not what they need. If it
is, maybe it would be good enough to use something like Access
(assuming a Windows target platform), XML, or Gnu DB. Given the OP's
stated experience I find this highly likely but we _just_don't_know_.

So really, there is no 90-10 rule that can be applied in this case.
Since this newsgroup has nothing to do with databases of any sort and
the OP is asking about databases (not C++ even though they may think
they are) it is fully appropriate and prudent to tell them they need to
go elsewhere for their answer as any answer given here is likely to be
totally useless to them - as yours very likely is.

 

[JustBoo]

You may think you are being helpful but in the end you are probably
just sending this guy on a wild goose chace.

*Probably*? My gawd how presumptions can you get. You have quite
literally no idea. I answered a straight-forward question. You gave an
opinion laden with assumptions. And btw, the above statement is
another example of your assumptions based on your baggage.

I remember when people in this group didn't obsessively, pedantically
and neurotically question every little motive of a poster. Instead
they just answered the question. It was up to the poster to decide the
applicability and efficacy of the answers. Yeah, believe it or not,
there would be more than the same answer repeated over and over, as
well.

I give people credit enough to take the information given, do some
investigation (by whatever means) and decide for themselves. I call it
Comparative Analysis. Look into it.

Oracle is a highly developed RDBMS used by data wharhouses and others
requiring the storage and retrieval of vast stores of information. It
is a very high end solution and is priced accordingly.

You intentionally left this (below) out or your quote.

So, it can be used for what you said. It also can NOT be. Oracle does
more than you know. See clarification below. One thing is clear you
are clueless about Oracle.

For the record I also gave him a link to many FREE DB's as well.
Hmm....

For a project
being developed by someone starting a month ago this is probably MAJOR
overkill. Your "90-10" rule might apply, but it appears to apply
Ass-umptions.

inversly to how you are using it; of course we can't know since the OP
neither specified the problem domain nor the target architecture.

Now you are talking some sense.

Btw. You intentionally leff this (below) out or your quote.
I find it amusing you're lecturing on something you obviously have
very little knowledge of. I see a trend. Give ya' a hint. One of
Oracle's strengths is a thing called "scalability." I'll leave that to
your magnificent legend-in-your-own-mind intellect to figure out what
that means. Um, btw, I've been using Oracle in a production
environment since the late Eighties. Care to lecture some more?

In reality the responses telling this person that they are in the wrong
newsgroup are more beneficial.

In your myopic traffic cop mentality sure. Again, I give people credit
to figure a few things out for themselves.

In fact any attempt at answering the
OP's actual question is certain to be counterproductive since there is
not adiquate information to do so reasonably.

I could not disagree more strongly. I think this shows more about
*your* baggage than the posters.

He asked about C++ and databases in a newsgroup designed to be a
place to ask questions. (Imagine that.) I gave him the info he asked
for, not a bunch of assumptions. It's up to *him* to decide if it's a
wild goose chase or not. It's up to *him* to decide if this is too
much too soon. Not you. Do you also want to decide when his beddy-bye
time is? Perhaps what tax rate he should pay? How about the color of
his car? Because, you know, after all, you're doing it for his own
good. Again I see a pattern.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of
ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent
virtue is the equal sharing of misery."
- Winston Churchill

This is why I
recommended that they talk to the person they originally consulted;
this person knows more about the problem and obviously has some idea
how to go about solving it.

He alerady talked to this person. HE then decided to come to this ng
for some advice. You're now talking about a circular goose-chase.

For one thing the OP needs to decide what, if any, RDBMS to use

Bingo. *He* has to decide; not you.

For one thing the OP needs to decide what, if any, RDBMS to use and
find support for that API; they are simply in the wrong place for that.
There are too many choices available for us to make assumptions as to

[snipped repetitive drivel]

Gee, remember when usenet was also called *Discussion Groups* Oh, I
guess you do not.

So really, there is no 90-10 rule that can be applied in this case.
Since this newsgroup has nothing to do with databases of any sort and
the OP is asking about databases (not C++ even though they may think
they are)

WhooopWhoooopWhoooop It's the Net Police. Too litlle, too late.

it is fully appropriate and prudent to tell them they need to
go elsewhere

Yeah, like how I directed him to sources of information to do some
research and ALL you did was reply with a bunch of snotty assumptions
with no actual content? You mean like that?

for their answer as any answer given here is likely to be
totally useless to them - as yours very likely is.

Ever heard of Psychological Projection? Look into it. Um, your
Freudian Slip is showing. Yeesh, I don't think pink is a good color
for you.

Examine your reply for *useful content* given the question he asked,
and then look at mine. Please cite the links and factual data you
gave him. Hmmm... interesting.

"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. Ignorance may
deride it. But in the end, there it is." - Winston Churchill

Super Bowl Time! I'm out. Have fun with your reflection..

 

[Tom]

[snipped it all out]

Hey Boo --

You cite some valuable experience with some obvious deep knowledge of
your area of expertise. I understand the frustration when helping (or
as often in my case >> "trying" to help) and having to defend a
position. It would be nice for folks to talk more in generality and be
less attacking with the quote box and trying to rub someone's words
back at them. Gee, I am here to learn and those who dream this place
is solely about C++ and not C and not databases and not computers and
not life are the same types that try to justify being the self
appointed Off Topic police.

Here's a challenge to the OT police of the group:

Instead of rudely telling the offender where to go ...

// ### Take it upon yourself to redirect the ###
// ### question towards a pure C++ topic and ###
// ### discuss it so that the group can learn ###
// ### from your experiences. ###

Don't just cry foul and contribute nothing. I learn nothing from the
repeated postings that tell someone they are lost. Don't you think
they will eventually figure it out?

Defending yourself when attacked is fully justifiable. Attacking and
being inconsiderate or just outright rude is a pathetic waste of
everyone's time.

I'd be thrilled for Boo to post about database experiences. Put "OT"
in the heading to warn off those that are here only for C++. I'll read
every word and enjoy the perspective from the eyes of an expert in a
field I know very little.

The C++ NG can be about more than just quirky rules needed to get very
confusing features synchronized. This community can be about life,
politeness, and so much more. High level programming requires
philosophy of thought that goes beyond the C++ rule book. Guests come
and go and while they are here they should all be treated with equal
kindness.

Learning can be fun. You learn most from your mistakes. So I say to
the OT police... open your minds and show us all a higher level of
intelligence. C++ solutions involve interaction with other computer
languages and with real life situations. You don't have to read every
posting ... so relax and let's all have more fun.

Just put yourself in the place of the newbie that started this topic.
Consider how this topic exploded and all the rudeness that was shown.
Do you think they would post again? Or are they more likely to think a
bunch of ____ (fill in the blank) hang out in here? It is not a
moderated group and I did not have to pass a proficiency test to
participate.

How about we start a top 10 list of what the OT police deserve? Folks
can vote on the funniest of the lot. My offerings are:

a) Off Topic Police deserve lots of trolls.
b) Off Topic Police deserve jalepeno juice in their Preparation-H.
c) Off Topic Police deserve a chance to elevate themselves up to dumb
blonde joke status.

-- Noisy Tom

 

[roberts.noah]

Just put yourself in the place of the newbie that started this topic.
Consider how this topic exploded and all the rudeness that was shown.
Do you think they would post again?

It is not rude to tell someone to post in an appropriate group. I
myself started learning C++ some years ago and posted off topic
questions to groups such as this. I was directed to more appropriate
places, went there, and got my answers.

It would also be very difficult to make this subject topical. The
question _is_ about databases, not C++. At that level the language
used is not important and has little bearing on using the connection
API. As such it is better answered in a support forum for database
programming.