Accept -language

  • Thread starter Luigi Donatello Asero
  • Start date
A

Andrew Urquhart

*Luigi Donatello Asero* wrote in alt.html:
'Svezia' is Sweden yes? For me it was 'en' in the UK, so it's either
using the header sent by your browser (which is usually based on the
language set for your operating system) or (somewhat less likely) it's
doing a reverse DNS-lookup on your IP address.
 
L

Luigi Donatello Asero

Andrew Urquhart said:
*Luigi Donatello Asero* wrote in alt.html:

'Svezia' is Sweden yes? For me it was 'en' in the UK, so it's either
using the header sent by your browser (which is usually based on the
language set for your operating system) or (somewhat less likely) it's
doing a reverse DNS-lookup on your IP address.
--
Andrew Urquhart
- FAQ: http://www.html-faq.com
- Archive: http://www.google.com/groups?q=alt.html
- Contact me: http://andrewu.co.uk/contact/

Yes, "Svezia" is Sweden in Italian.
Actually, you have to use the determinative article in Italian before the
name of a country, and in this case the article is "la".
So, "la Svezia" means also Sweden.
Can I do something to let validators, and robots understand when a page is
in one language and another page in another language, (for example
http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/sv/sicilien.html
although both pages belong to he same website?
 
A

Andrew Urquhart

*Luigi Donatello Asero* wrote in alt.html:
*Andrew Urquhart* said:
[snip] it's either using the header sent by your browser [...] or
[...] doing a reverse DNS-lookup on your IP address.
[snip]
Can I do something to let validators, and robots understand when a page is
in one language and another page in another language, (for example
http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/sv/sicilien.html
although both pages belong to he same website?

If this is a problem for you then the GUI for the link checker would
seem to have the answer: <URL: http://validator.w3.org/checklink> with
the 'Don't send the Accept-Language header' checkbox!
--
Andrew Urquhart
- FAQ: http://www.html-faq.com
- Archive: http://www.google.com/groups?q=alt.html
- Fix OE quoting: http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
- Contact me: http://andrewu.co.uk/contact/
 
K

Kim André Akerø

Luigi Donatello Asero said:
Here is the result:
http://validator.w3.org/checklink?u.../svezia.html&hide_type=all&depth=&check=Check

For me, it appears as:
Accept-Language: no;q=1.0,en;q=0.9

Which, in fact, corresponds to my browser's language priority settings.
Accept-Language is one of the headers usually sent by your own browser, not
in response from your server. Meaning, the W3C Link Checker most likely
imported your own language settings and passed that on to your website.
http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-accept-lang-locales

Most likely, you've set up Swedish (language code "se") in your browser's
language settings.
 
L

Luigi Donatello Asero

Andrew Urquhart said:
*Luigi Donatello Asero* wrote in alt.html:
*Andrew Urquhart* said:
[snip] it's either using the header sent by your browser [...] or
[...] doing a reverse DNS-lookup on your IP address.
[snip]
Can I do something to let validators, and robots understand when a page is
in one language and another page in another language, (for example
http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/sv/sicilien.html
although both pages belong to he same website?

If this is a problem for you then the GUI for the link checker would
seem to have the answer: <URL: http://validator.w3.org/checklink> with
the 'Don't send the Accept-Language header' checkbox!

Well, that only affects the link checker, doesn´t it? But what about robots
and search engines?
 
J

Jukka K. Korpela

Luigi Donatello Asero said:
By checking the links of the page
http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/it/svezia.html
the "Accept-language" of the link checker showed Swedish instead of
Italian
although
I used <html lang="it">
Why?

What the browser sends has absolutely nothing to do with your HTML
markup. Moreover, in language negotiation - which is what Accept-Language
is for - the HTML markup is completely irrelevant, too. Search engines,
unfortunately, ignore the lang attribute too.

Pretty much the only benefit you currently get from lang="it" is that
when someone visits your page with a modern speech browser like IBM Home
Page Reader, the browser automatically reads the text by the
pronunciation rules for Italian, if it supports this language.

It's still a good idea to use lang attributes (and it's mandatory by WAI
recommendations). But don't expect them to do things they weren't meant
for or just don't do.

For multiple-language site design, I still recommend my treatise
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/multi/

In particular, if you simply links all the different versions together
with normal links, you don't need to worry about search engines (in this
respect).
 
L

Luigi Donatello Asero

Jukka K. Korpela said:
What the browser sends has absolutely nothing to do with your HTML
markup. Moreover, in language negotiation - which is what Accept-Language
is for - the HTML markup is completely irrelevant, too. Search engines,
unfortunately, ignore the lang attribute too.

Thank you for your answer.

If you look for some search terms like "lägenheter i Italien" on
www.altavista.se the site http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com has a better
rankning if you
choose the alternative "hela världen" instead of "Sverige". Yet, the results
which you get are in Swedish
Please compare:
http://se.altavista.com/web/results?itag=wrx&q=lägenheter+i+Italien&kgs=1&kls=0
http://se.altavista.com/web/results?itag=wrx&q=lägenheter+i+Italien&kgs=0&kls=0

and I am in Sweden
Please read:
http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/sv/indirizzi.html
http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/it/indirizziit.html
http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/en/adresses.html
http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com/it/indirizziit.html
That´s why I am wondering whether the search engine actually
Pretty much the only benefit you currently get from lang="it" is that
when someone visits your page with a modern speech browser like IBM Home
Page Reader, the browser automatically reads the text by the
pronunciation rules for Italian, if it supports this language.

It's still a good idea to use lang attributes (and it's mandatory by WAI
recommendations). But don't expect them to do things they weren't meant
for or just don't do.

For multiple-language site design, I still recommend my treatise
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/multi/

I tried to visit the page. Did you check up all the links?
In particular, if you simply links all the different versions together
with normal links, you don't need to worry about search engines (in this
respect).

I already try to do that. It just takes time because the different versions
of one page are not made at the same time.
Please, also consider that they are not often a pure translation. The page
is also adapted to the different users.
Besides there is not always a correspondent page because I sometimes want to
adress a message only to some users. For example I do not offer the
intermediation for rent of holiday lodgings which are situated in Italy to
tourist who are resident in Italy but I offer it to landlords and landladies
who are resident there.
 
J

Jukka K. Korpela

Luigi Donatello Asero said:
If you look for some search terms like "lägenheter i Italien" on
www.altavista.se the site http://www.scaiecat-spa-gigi.com has a
better rankning if you
choose the alternative "hela världen" instead of "Sverige".

I have no idea how AltaVista (which is now just Overture under a
different name - quite different from the old AltaVista until this
spring) ranks the results. I have no reason to expect that this is the
least connected with any Accept-Language that you were referring to.
That´s why I am wondering whether the search engine actually

Your sentence seems to terminate before you meant it it to end.
Anyway, while it is _imaginable_ that an indexing robot sends an
Accept-Language header, I cannot see why it would do so. It will happily
index everything it gets and passes some reasonability tests, then puts
it into a database, perhaps with language information. But it's not
particularly interested in asking for a specific language variant.
I tried to visit the page. Did you check up all the links?

Oh, I check links only by accident. But the address should work -
naturally by language negotiation, though unfortunately the real
alternatives are just English and Finnish, the rest is just sketchy
demos.
I already try to do that. It just takes time because the different
versions of one page are not made at the same time.

Secret hint: Although it's generally bad practice to put "under
construction" pages onto the Web, it might be justifiable to put a
translation there, and make links point to it from other pages, as soon
as you have _some_ useful content. Like a heading and a summary, followed
by a note like "(Rest of the page not translated yet.)". That way,
indexing robots will find the page sooner, and then hopefully update
their data bases when they later find a newer version.
 
L

Luigi Donatello Asero

Jukka K. Korpela said:
I have no idea how AltaVista (which is now just Overture under a
different name - quite different from the old AltaVista until this
spring) ranks the results. I have no reason to expect that this is the
least connected with any Accept-Language that you were referring to.

Is there anyone else here who knows how it happens?
Anyway, while it is _imaginable_ that an indexing robot sends an
Accept-Language header, I cannot see why it would do so. It will happily
index everything it gets and passes some reasonability tests, then puts
it into a database, perhaps with language information. But it's not
particularly interested in asking for a specific language variant.
What happens if it puts the wrong language information?

Are you sure that
the language information is not connected with the way pages are ranked
( see above)?
Oh, I check links only by accident. But the address should work -
naturally by language negotiation, though unfortunately the real
alternatives are just English and Finnish, the rest is just sketchy
demos.
Don´t you think that it would be a good practice to check them more often?
Most links did not work.
 

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments. After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.

Ask a Question

Similar Threads

Links which are not public 2
Menu 10
Link checker 6
Text browser 7
<html lang="sv, it, en, de"> 4
Min-width. 2
Grouping and bypassing links 3
Please criticize this page (not on the whole website!) 106

Members online

No members online now.

Forum statistics

Threads
473,774
Messages
2,569,596
Members
45,143
Latest member
DewittMill
Top