What's the best non-JVM native language to look at?

[Jeff Higgins]

????

I suspect Martin Gregorie means this:
<http://www.microsoftvirtualacademy....windows-8-and-windows-phone-8-app-development>.

 

[Jeff Higgins]

I suspect Martin Gregorie means this:
<http://www.microsoftvirtualacademy....windows-8-and-windows-phone-8-app-development>.

From the presentation:
Platform-specific Features
Similar features with different APIs and implementations
Do not try to reuse code for these features
Some examples:
Application lifecycle (PLM)
Background processing
Tiles and toast notifications
Image/video capture
System services
App bar
Networking differences

 

[Jeff Higgins]

From what I've written so far you might be able to see where the disorientation / confusion originates from ... My mind says I should do some C proramming where there is the best chance to do some work with it at some company one day. But my heard tells me to do some more fancy stuff like Go or D.

Thanks. Just got my first Go workspace set up. The go tool seems to work
as advertised. Now to tackle the for loop.

 

[Arne Vajhøj]

From the presentation:
Platform-specific Features
Similar features with different APIs and implementations
Do not try to reuse code for these features
Some examples:
Application lifecycle (PLM)
Background processing
Tiles and toast notifications
Image/video capture
System services
App bar
Networking differences

I did not watch it.

But "Do not try to reuse code for these features" sounds like
"the API is the same but you should do things differently".

Which does not surprise me.

Arne

 

[Arne Vajhøj]

windows-phone-8-app-development>.

I hadn't seen that, but had read about the incompatible Win8 APIs in an
article in The Register.

Just because something is written on the internet, then it is
not necessarily true.

Microsoft actually publishes documentation where it is clearly
indicated what is supported on what platforms.

Speculation like "There's absolutely no excuse for file system APIs to
differ" based on a story on a web site, when the documentation clearly
states that a number of classes for file system access actually are
supported on both Win8 and WinPC8.

Arne

 

[Arne Vajhøj]

Sure - I'm not saying they should be the same, only that I don't see any
reason why a program shouldn't use the same API to display menus and
accept input from them regardless of how the OS chooses to display the
menus. After all, a program that is useful on a desktop, tablet or phone
will need to display the same menus and accept the same inputs from them
regardless of which device its running on. Similar arguments apply to all
the other elements of a graphical interface.

But applications does not have the same menus on PC and phone. The
phone version is usually a lot simpler.

Arne

 

[Jeff Higgins]

I did not watch it.

Me neither.
I downloaded the slides for the first part of the presentation.
Then I would have been required to register before any more access.

But "Do not try to reuse code for these features" sounds like
"the API is the same but you should do things differently".

Actually, the point was that these APIs are different and here
is what you can do to maximize code reuse.

One of the slides promises:
<quote>
We are on the path to
Windows and Windows Phone
convergence

 

[Arne Vajhøj]

Me neither.
I downloaded the slides for the first part of the presentation.
Then I would have been required to register before any more access.


Actually, the point was that these APIs are different and here
is what you can do to maximize code reuse.

One of the slides promises:
<quote>
We are on the path to
Windows and Windows Phone
convergence
</quote>

"these APIs are different" is not a very technical description. It
is even close to me misleading.

MS invented a new API to be shared between Windows 8 and
Windows Phone 8.

Exactly what was requested in this thread.

Windows Phone did not get the full version in 8.0.

People that has counted say that WP 8 WinRT has
2800/11000 of what Win8 WinRT has (measured in
public members of the classes).

MS has also stated that they will increase that in 8.1
(already released for Win, soon to be released for WP)
and further increase it in 9.

But some classes may never be in WP. I am skeptical about
namespaces like:
* Windows.Devices.Enumeration.Pnp
* Windows.Devices.HumanInterfaceDevice
* Windows.Graphics.Printing

Arne

 

[Jeff Higgins]

"these APIs are different" is not a very technical description. It
is even close to me misleading.

I guess short of registering for the course and watching 4-6 hours
of video you could download the first section of slides, as I've done.

MS invented a new API to be shared between Windows 8 and
Windows Phone 8.

MS has "invented" a lot of stuff. They've also produced
two platforms, Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8, as you've noted.

Exactly what was requested in this thread.

Windows Phone did not get the full version in 8.0.

People that has counted say that WP 8 WinRT has
2800/11000 of what Win8 WinRT has (measured in
public members of the classes).

MS has also stated that they will increase that in 8.1
(already released for Win, soon to be released for WP)
and further increase it in 9.

They've also produced a 4-6 hour video course that:After this presentation, you should have a good
understanding of:
Major similarities and differences between Windows Phone 8 and Windows 8
How to build apps for both Windows Phone 8 and Windows 8 with maximum
code reuse
This presentation does not cover:
How to write a Windows Phone 8 app
How to write a Windows 8 app
A way to write apps that automatically run on both platforms (not possible)
<<

 

[Jeff Higgins]

The other day a clerk at the Verizon store
checked checked me out completely on his handheld device.
Credit card, printed receipt, the whole nine yards.

 

[Arne Vajhøj]

I guess short of registering for the course and watching 4-6 hours
of video you could download the first section of slides, as I've done.

MS has "invented" a lot of stuff.

Yes.

But wouldn't it make more sense to criticize them for not doing
something if they did not do it?

Arne

 

[Jeff Higgins]

You've snipped my comment.

They've also produced a 4-6 hour video course that:After this presentation, you should have a good
understanding of:
Major similarities and differences between Windows Phone 8 and Windows 8
How to build apps for both Windows Phone 8 and Windows 8 with maximum
code reuse
This presentation does not cover:
How to write a Windows Phone 8 app
How to write a Windows 8 app
A way to write apps that automatically run on both platforms (not possible)
<<

Yes.

But wouldn't it make more sense to criticize them for not doing
something if they did not do it?

Huh? Now's my turn for the ????

*I'm* not criticizing anyone.
I'm pointing to Microsoft's own course on current
best practices in code reuse between w8 & wp8.

 

[Arved Sandstrom]

Way back when C++ was the new kid on the block I remember reading that
the first C++ compilker was actually a standard C compiler with the Cfront
preprocessor substituted for the usual cpre preprocessor.

====

Personally I still can't be arsed to spend the time needed to learn C++.
I looked at it some time ago and found it offensive for both its
complexity and the obscene amount of code generated. In any case, far too
much of the so-called "C++" I've looked at has been nothing more than
ANSI C with comments delimited by "//": and not class or object in sight.

I agree about the complexity. I'll wager most people do, even C++
supporters...in fact some C++ aficionados glory in the complexity of the
language. This is exactly why most C++ programmers use a small subset of
the "++" stuff...and not even that always correctly.

I don't know what you mean by generated code. Templates, presumably. Or
is it executable size? Neither is a problem. I'm more worried about
_Java_ code bloat. This is not a major C++-specific problem.

If a programming task is essentially file manipulation I'll use awk. If
the job is moderately complex and can be written in ANSI C I'll use that.
If an OO approach is called for I'll use Java and, if some fiddling is
required that Java can't do, I'll use a combination of C and Java with
sockets for inter-language data transfer.

I probably wouldn't resort to C as quickly as you do, but my general
philosophy - given free rein - is not way different. I certainly don't
see Java as the go-to language for everything...and some people do.

I say "given free rein" because most of the time it's not possible to
use the best language on a real job, for various reasons.

If I had to nominate *one* programming language that I think is #1
all-time, awk (and some variants) would be my choice.

AHS