IE cannot open the Internet site ... Operation aborted

T

Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn

Dr said:
[...] Mika said:
Out of interest why does body have a double-slash "\/" before it?
Click to expand...

The pragmatical reason is, I expect, that with just "/" the code will be
deemed invalid by reputable validators such as Opera Ctrl-Alt-V
Click to expand...

That only invokes the W3C Validator (by default) and other UAs provide a
similar feature to do that (Firefox with the Web Developer extension), so
you should have named that instead:

http://validator.w3.org/
and W3's downloadable TIDY.
Click to expand...

HTML Tidy is _not_ a validator, it is a markup cleaner that also provides
some degree of plausibility and even accessibility check. And it is no
longer maintained by the original author, Dave Raggett of the W3C;
development had moved on to the Open Source community at SourceForge before
2004-06 CE.


F'up2 comp.infosystems.www.authoring.html

PointedEars
 
A

Andy Dingley

I should have thought that was obvious.
Click to expand...

Obviously not.

HTML was designed from the start as a subset of SGML that would permit
lax coding of tags
Click to expand...

There's nothing "lax" about SGML's permitted optimisations. You're
allowed what you're allowed, no more. The fact that it's famously
difficult for humans (~Jukka) to understand the rules relating
optimised tags to elements doesn't mean they're "lax", just complex.

In fact, HTML is considerably _less_ "lax" than SGML might otherwise
have permitted.

If you said that it was harder to manually _author_ correct HTML than
correct XHTML, I'd have agreed with you. However to validate it as
being error-free, you do this to either of them by applying a pre-
existing freely available validator to them. For you as an author,
this is equally difficult for either.
and allow addition of non-specified tags
Click to expand...

HTML doesn't permit this. The fact that many people _chose_ to, and
that some chose to do it in a manner (by specifying a new and extended
DTD) that was valid SGML (although thus no longer HTML at all) doesn't
make it right.
XHTML is - of course - simply XML.
Click to expand...

Is it? All that can be said today with any real confidence about
"XHTML on the web" is that you can't do it with "XHTML as XML" because
IE refuses it.

Now if XHTML is XML, we're allowed XML namespacing and so we can
(directly contradicting your claim) safely add extra elements or
attributes. However in today's world of "XHTML as XHTML" we can't do
this with any more validity then simply dropping them into HTML as in
the past.
 
I

Ian Hobson

Mika said:
Hello, we understand you guys may be able to help.

We have a page which has been working great for over a year and gets many
hits. However recently something got changed that we cannot seem to find,
and now *sometimes* if you refresh the page (generally while it is still
loading) in IE7, we get the popup window error:

Internet Explorer cannot open the Internet site...
Operation aborted
Click to expand...

I had to disable javascript just to get the page to load into Firefox.

My Advice....

1) Remove ALL javascript.

2) No remove ALL of it - google ads included. ALL means EVERY LAST DAMN
BIT.

3) Fix the HTML - Having three <head>, and three <body> tags is an
abortion! LINK can ONLY go in the header. Your page is such a mess it
can't be described as "tag soup". It a dogs breakfast! Fix.

4) Make sure the html validates under HTML 4 strict doc type. (Yes, that
means CSS for styling, and javascript for target=).

Make sure your page at this stage is usable (plain and dull is 100% fine
- I want usable). If a visitor can't navigate and buy stuff, fix the
application! Your customer won't agree to 5-10% of visitors being unable
to use his site or buy his products.

5)Add CSS to make your page layout as you want, and to style it so it
looks nice. If you have to alter the HTML, revalidate it.

6) If you want to show silly quotes or other dynamic content use a tool
designed for the purpose - PHP, ASP, Perl, Ruby, CGI, SSI or even server
side javascript for heavens sake! That is a SERVER side job! DO it
there! Not in the user's browser!

7) If there is any javascript left, perhaps to make the user interface
more convenient, or less error prone, add it back in. Ensure that NONE
is executed until appropriate by putting it ALL in the header. Trigger
with on-click on on-load events as required.

(Possible exception - inline javascript using document.write, to create
mailto anchors to defeat harvesters.).

Important - don't touch the DOM in in-line javascript.

8) Check your HTML still passes validation. Check your page works on
lots of browsers.

9) Put the Google ads back, inline as given - and realise that your page
will now fail validation.

Don't confuse the vigour of my advice with criticism. The mess has been
created by the templating system that has not helped you.

And consider using a version control system. That way when you back out
a change, you absolutely know it is 100% removed.
It would have saved all of this hassle.

Regards

Ian
 
M

Mika

Hello Ian

Sorry you seem to unhappy.
I had to disable javascript just to get the page to load into Firefox.
Click to expand...

This is very strange indeed. We must have tested this on dozens of Firefox
clients and never had a problem. The site has been live for 1.5 years and
not a single complaint from Firefox users, yet thousands of return Firefox
visitors. Could you try it again - perhaps you were referring to a broken
test page not the actual live pages? Try this page please:

http://tinyurl.com/35mwxr
My Advice....

3) Fix the HTML - Having three <head>, and three <body> tags is an
abortion! LINK can ONLY go in the header. Your page is such a mess it
can't be described as "tag soup". It a dogs breakfast! Fix.
Click to expand...

This is a misnomer as it is actually the 2 SSI pages' own head and body that
you are seeing. It does not affect the operation at all, and if we remove
the tags from the 2 SSI pages then they cease to display correctly
elsewhere. It is not the cause of the issue, which as I have stated a
number of times, is a known and accepted bug between IE and Google Maps API.
6) If you want to show silly quotes or other dynamic content ...
Click to expand...

We don't mind constructive criticism, but that is not constructive, it is
rude. I do not wish to get into a discussion about that however. The
quotes are not the cause of the issue this thread is about, again.
And consider using a version control system. That way when you back out a
change, you absolutely know it is 100% removed.
It would have saved all of this hassle.
Click to expand...

We did restore the backup but the issue remained. We feel it may have been
there all along, just we never refreshed the page whilst it was loading and
hit one of the random times the bug would occur before.

Thanks for your time. If you could answer our query about your issue with
Firefox that would help, as it is worrying that yours is the first such
report on this entire thread and in 18 months of live use. Perhaps there is
something wrong with your system.

Mika
 
B

Beauregard T. Shagnasty

Hello Ian
Sorry you seem to unhappy.


This is very strange indeed. We must have tested this on dozens of
Firefox clients and never had a problem. The site has been live for
1.5 years and not a single complaint from Firefox users, yet
Click to expand...

Here's another.
thousands of return Firefox visitors. Could you try it again -
perhaps you were referring to a broken test page not the actual live
pages? Try this page please:

http://tinyurl.com/35mwxr
Click to expand...
http://www.superhighstreet.com/George-Street-Richmond/index.shtml

Firefox 2.0.0.9, JavaScript on:
"Please be patient while we teleport you there
(around 15 secs via fast broadband ...so a bit quicker than driving!)"

Still waiting, ten minutes later (on a 10Mbps connection), for whatever
that "progress bar" is supposed to represent.

Why does this page have an ugly purple background? (Think about that.)

What is that row of four unidentified icons for?

There is a huge empty blue area below the "progress bar."

<http://validator.w3.org/check?verbo...street.com/George-Street-Richmond/index.shtml>
This page is not Valid HTML 4.01 Transitional!
Result: Failed validation, 66 Errors

Why isn't this site Strict instead of Transitional?
This is a misnomer as it is actually the 2 SSI pages' own head and
body that you are seeing. It does not affect the operation at all,
and if we remove the tags from the 2 SSI pages then they cease to
display correctly elsewhere.
Click to expand...

Then fix "elsewhere".
Thanks for your time. If you could answer our query about your issue with
Firefox that would help, as it is worrying that yours is the first such
report on this entire thread and in 18 months of live use. Perhaps there is
something wrong with your system.
Click to expand...

There's nothing wrong with my "system(s)".

You've posted your site in the past, and as I recall, each time someone
told you of problems, not the least of which was load times.

Oh, and why did you interrupt my jazz CD with something that sounds like
waves on a beach? What's that got to do with George Street?

Same in Opera...
 
J

Jonathan N. Little

Beauregard said:
In alt.html, Mika wrote:
Click to expand...

{Restored quote reference} Ian Hobson said:
<http://validator.w3.org/check?verbo...street.com/George-Street-Richmond/index.shtml>
This page is not Valid HTML 4.01 Transitional!
Result: Failed validation, 66 Errors

Why isn't this site Strict instead of Transitional?


Then fix "elsewhere".
Click to expand...

I believe we told him that 1.5 years ago. If your are using SSI to
combine whole html documents then your are doing it wrong. Either make
your SSI include documents contain *only* the parts of the page that you
need to include OR do not use SSI. It's the wrong tool and you should
use some other server side script to open such documents and parse to
extract *only* the bits your need to assemble a valid html document.

There's nothing wrong with my "system(s)".
Click to expand...

If your page is patchwork Frankenstein with extra bits and invalid
markup then you are relying a browser's ability to "guess" what it is
supposed to be algorithms to some how display the page. Not a good plan.
You've posted your site in the past, and as I recall, each time someone
told you of problems, not the least of which was load times.
Click to expand...

Last time I check it was over 6MB...
 
B

Beauregard T. Shagnasty

In said:
Last time I check it was over 6MB...
Click to expand...

Probably still is. The site seems to block
http://www.websiteoptimization.com/services/analyze/
returning a 403 Forbidden.

BTW, did you notice the *<title>* element? Sorry for posting this here,
but it is sooooo ridiculous, I felt it needed to be pointed out;

<title>Virtual George Street Online Shopping, Richmond &amp; Kew,
Surrey, TW9, UK - Find Dickens &amp; Jones, House of Fraser, Karen
Millen, Gant, Habitat, M&amp;S, Monsoon, Robert Dyas, Uniqlo, Abbey
National, Starbucks, Hobbs, Gap Kids, Tesco, Clinton Cards, East, Vision
Express, NatWest, Reed, WHSmith, L'Occitane, Superdrug, Barclays,
Russell and Bromley, 3, Three, Timberland, David Clulow, Molton Brown,
Tao, Crabtree
&amp; Evelyn, Aveda, Redchat, Bowleys, Reiss, HMV, HSBC, Clarks, Boots,
D&amp;A, French Connection, fcuk, Ernest Jones, N Courlander, HengJi
Properties, Top Shop, Ann Summers, Dixons, Currys.digital, Holland
&amp; Barrett, The Body Shop, Nine West, Pied a Terre, Accessorize,
Laura Ashley, Oasis, the Orange shop, Jigsaw, Hill Street, The Quadrant,
credit card, wireless, anti spam, affiliate pay per click, google
adsense, auto, car, motor, car hire, affiliate programme, gift card, bad
credit, cheap insurance, purchase web site domain names, egg credit,
home equity, loans, federal, debt consolidation, hair removal, health
insurance, internet software, lemons, mortgage, no cost, personal
injury, refinance, student loan, yahoo,
Waterstones, Post Office, Whittard, Odeon, Carphone Warehouse, Lloyds
TSB, Next, shopping,online shopping,shop
online,shop,online,home,virtual,outlet,buy,high,main,street,st.,rd.,road,
cyber,mall,interactive,january,summer,sales,guide,map,simulator,sightseeing,
city,town,centre,center,chain,store,world,famous,boutique,retailer,product,
alternative,disabled,disability, estate
agents,holidays,flights,moving,cinemas,restaurants,bars,cafes,pubs,clubs,tourist
attractions,tourism,landmarks,banks,buy,clothes,apparel,electronics,mobile
phones,dvds,salons,shoes,digital
cameras,pharmacies,chemists,drugs,panoramic,panorama,360,quick
searches,shoppy,cheap,discount,cart,bargains,deals,great deals,special
offers,offers,cashback,rebates,cash rebates,coupons,cash rebates,cash
back,find,locate shops,locate,locations,map,local,compare prices,best
prices,cheapest prices,comparison,comparison shopping,search
amazon,search ebay,UK,USA</title>

This is nothing more than search engine stuffing, and he should be
penalized for it. The first few words would suffice. I wonder why
"lemons" are listed... maybe because it is a lemon of a site?

The <meta keywords> are just as bad.

Heh, googling for "george street online" (with quotes), the page isn't
listed at all, so I guess Google has whacked his peepee for it.
 
J

Jonathan N. Little

Beauregard said:
Probably still is. The site seems to block
http://www.websiteoptimization.com/services/analyze/
returning a 403 Forbidden.

BTW, did you notice the *<title>* element? Sorry for posting this here,
but it is sooooo ridiculous, I felt it needed to be pointed out;
Click to expand...

This is nothing more than search engine stuffing, and he should be
penalized for it. The first few words would suffice. I wonder why
"lemons" are listed... maybe because it is a lemon of a site?

The <meta keywords> are just as bad.

Heh, googling for "george street online" (with quotes), the page isn't
listed at all, so I guess Google has whacked his peepee for it.
Click to expand...

It's a "Spruce Goose", but we informed them that almost to years ago,
but whatever we say now won't matter they are too deeply committed
without an "exit strategy"
 
M

Mika

Heh, googling for "george street online" (with quotes), the page isn't
listed at all, so I guess Google has whacked his peepee for it.
Click to expand...

That phrase does not exist in our site so you are intentionally not finding
it by putting it in quotes.

Search just for george street richmond and it comes up no. 1.

Don't mind people pointing out genuine errors, but it is best not to make up
stories to suit your side.

I wonder if you guys were playground bullies the way you talk on here to
strangers. If you wouldn't say it in that tone to somebody's face, don't
online - that's the acid test.

You are all very impressed with yourselves and abilities to understand HTML
or j/s, but what we could teach you about interpersonal relationships!...

Over and out.

Mika
 
B

Beauregard T. Shagnasty

That phrase does not exist in our site so you are intentionally not
finding it by putting it in quotes.
What?


Search just for george street richmond and it comes up no. 1.
Click to expand...

I was pointing out the futility of you stuffing hundreds of words in the
Don't mind people pointing out genuine errors, but it is best not to
make up stories to suit your side.
Click to expand...

As proven above, I didn't make it up.
I wonder if you guys were playground bullies the way you talk on here
to strangers. If you wouldn't say it in that tone to somebody's
face, don't online - that's the acid test.
Click to expand...

I would say anything I've typed here to your face. Are you gonna be in
New York anytime soon?
You are all very impressed with yourselves and abilities to
understand HTML or j/s, but what we could teach you about
interpersonal relationships!...
Click to expand...

Over and out.
Click to expand...

Bye.
 
B

Bone Ur

Well bust mah britches and call me cheeky, on Thu, 22 Nov 2007 23:18:04
GMT Mika scribed:

You are all very impressed with yourselves and abilities to understand
HTML or j/s, but what we could teach you about interpersonal
relationships!...

Over and out.
Click to expand...

Hey, these are the _nice_ guys! You should run into the hardcore cases
like Jukka and rf... Even ol' dorayme can spit some venom when rattled
agitatively. And Blinky The Shark - whoaaaaaa! There's a mouthful to
watch out for. You've been lucky, my man, so count your blessings.
 
M

Mika

Here's another.

Firefox 2.0.0.9, JavaScript on:
"Please be patient while we teleport you there
(around 15 secs via fast broadband ...so a bit quicker than driving!)"

Still waiting, ten minutes later (on a 10Mbps connection), for whatever
that "progress bar" is supposed to represent.
Click to expand...

I wonder what the precise reason is that all the v2 Firefox browser machines
we can test on work perfectly, yet only in this group do they apparently
not. Do you have a standard installation, or any altered settings that may
cause it?

We also have 2.0.0.9 and the page loads in 2 seconds over a 4Mb/s line and
works perfectly every refresh.
Why does this page have an ugly purple background? (Think about that.)
Click to expand...

Could you elaborate please? It is white.

Thanks.
 
M

Mika

Beauregard T. Shagnasty said:
What?

<title>Virtual George Street Online Shopping, Richmond ...
...............^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Click to expand...

Apologies, it had been a long day and we thought you were referring to the
keywords tag.

Thanks for the advice - we will amend the title.
I would say anything I've typed here to your face. Are you gonna be in
New York anytime soon?
Click to expand...

No, we're too scared to now. Actually we weren't referring to you
specifically, just the general comments from others which are frankly rude
and we all know that they would not talk that way if not hiding behind a
screen. It's a shame people are so angry deep down and it has to spill out
when they have a 'safe' chance.
<lol!>
Click to expand...

;)
 
M

Mika

Oh, and why did you interrupt my jazz CD with something that sounds like
waves on a beach? What's that got to do with George Street?
Click to expand...

When it was featured on BBC Radio 1's top show, the presenter said, "they
simulate ... the experience of actual shopping ... complete with sound
effects".

I think you are intelligent enough to know it is a street noise and vehicles
whoosing past, but for some reason want to say it was a beach. That does
not really assist us.
Same in Opera...
Click to expand...

Opera is not supported due to low user % and as they do not allow wide
enough page lengths to permit our scrolling supercell. This is stated in
the FAQ, which I'm sure you read ;)
 
M

Mika

Jonathan N. Little said:
It's a "Spruce Goose", but we informed them that almost to years ago, but
whatever we say now won't matter they are too deeply committed without an
"exit strategy"
Click to expand...

We are flattered you talk about this like it is a big business. It is just
a hobby done in spare time! We think we have done quite well considering
that being beginners, and that we have incurred little or no startup
expenses. The site is accessed by thousands of repeat visitors monthly.
Last time I check it was over 6MB...
Click to expand...

6MB is not a load time. This site is clearly labelled as being for the
broadband generation. It says 'broadband recommended' on every page, and in
search engine listings, and the FAQ. 84% of the UK is now on broadband and
this is a UK oriented site. 6MB is about 2 seconds. Clearly that is not
really an issue to keep criticising the site for. As speeds increase this
will only become even less of an issue.

This thread was about a Google/MS issue, but we appreciate any
'constructive' polite comments.
your page is patchwork Frankenstein
Click to expand...

Unlike that.
 
M

Mika

The mess has been created by the templating system that has not helped
you.
Click to expand...

We would agree - Microsoft Expression Web Editor to be precise. It is
upsetting that it has caused many problems. We have been trying to work
through some today.

We have now solved the issue this thread was about. We now call the j/s in
a different file:

<script type="text/javascript" src="mapscript.js"></script>

However the problem with the templating system was that if we tried to but
this *after* the </body> tag, it would not allow it and moved it back.

Furthermore the reason we used SSI was after advice from this group a year
ago. The reason was the MS border navigation system which inserted our top
and bottom borders to all pages, did so by creating a table... and Google
Maps API cannot work within a table!

So all of this mess was caused by Microsoft (Expression Web, and IE)
incompatibilities or lack of understanding of Google Maps API. We have done
our best.

*Good news!* Our workaround is to edit the page in a text editor as the
final stage before uploading, and we move that tag to after the </body> tag.

* We can now refresh without Operation Aborted :)
* We have been able to dispense with SSI and use the top/bottom border :)
* We have also changed the doctype to Strict as suggested here (it was
Transitional because someone else here suggeted that months ago!). Again,
doing our best.

This leaves us with a problem hopefully someone here will be able to help us
fix?: In Firefox, there seem to be extra spaces or lines messing up the
formatting. See how the top border is broken up, and the table cells have
large lines above/below? This was after alterting the doctype, btu why?

Constructive polite replies welcomed :)
 
I

Ian Hobson

Mika said:
Hello Ian

Sorry you seem to unhappy.


This is very strange indeed. We must have tested this on dozens of Firefox
clients and never had a problem. The site has been live for 1.5 years and
not a single complaint from Firefox users, yet thousands of return Firefox
visitors. Could you try it again - perhaps you were referring to a broken
test page not the actual live pages? Try this page please:

http://tinyurl.com/35mwxr
Click to expand...
After an age I got a warning about an unresponsive script.

There is nothing wrong with my (broadband) setup.

Without wishing to be rude:

Your html is crap. You have been told this repeatedly.

Your javascript is unhelpful and visitor hostile.

Your approach is stubbornly wrong headed.

You have been given a lot of good advice over a long period.

Take it.

And Yes - I am pissed off with you. I spent time giving you a thoughtful
and considered response, because I thought I could help.

I can't help those who will not take advice.

Now re-read the advice you have been give by me and other, and follow
it, or go away.
 
B

Beauregard T. Shagnasty

I wonder what the precise reason is that all the v2 Firefox browser
machines we can test on work perfectly, yet only in this group do
they apparently not. Do you have a standard installation, or any
altered settings that may cause it?
Click to expand...

Other than Web Developer Toolbar, Firebug, and some adblock extensions
(in rather common usage), there is nothing unusual about my Firefox.
We also have 2.0.0.9 and the page loads in 2 seconds over a 4Mb/s line and
works perfectly every refresh.
Click to expand...

You are much closer to your server, perhaps.

14 216.6.87.53 33ms 31ms 193ms TTL: 0
(if-0-0.mcore4.NQT-NewYork.teleglobe.net ok)
15 207.45.220.38 109ms 110ms 109ms TTL: 0
(if-2-0.core1.LDN-London.Teleglobe.net ok)
16 195.219.195.17 113ms 113ms 110ms TTL: 0 (No rDNS)
17 195.219.195.66 136ms 138ms 137ms TTL: 0 (No rDNS)
18 89.238.140.17 136ms 138ms 137ms TTL: 0
(thn-mer.10g.lon.as33970.net fraudulent rDNS)
19 83.245.63.71 135ms 134ms 133ms TTL:107
(http1.yourwebservers.com bogus rDNS: host not found [authoritative])

Could you elaborate please? It is white.
Click to expand...

No, it isn't. It is whatever my (and your) browser's default background
color is. You haven't assigned one to body {} in your CSS.
http://k75s.home.att.net/show/george.jpg

I see you have removed the hundreds of useless keywords from your
<title> elements. At least we got that fixed...
 
M

Mika

Now re-read the advice you have been give by me and other, and follow it,
or go away.
Click to expand...

We have done some of the suggested work today. Please can you try again and
advise if the street now loads?:

http://tinyurl.com/35mwxr

I can't think why you would get an unresponsive script error. Are you in
the UK? If so you are as close to our server as we are.
 

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